Exhaust Aftertreatment Issues

[Texas149]

After lookin around I haven't seen a thread on Aftertreatment problems. In my area I'm seein more and more new trucks goin down with these systems in place. A lot of which are still under OEM warranty however it does little good when your shut down for a week waitin for them to even look at it. These Dpf filters are extremely sensitive and for those who are at the mercy of the new emission standards, maybe we can come together and make life a bit easier. If you have or had some issues please share! I myself and hopefully some others may be able to shed some light on a resolution:celticparty:

[radu_gostian]

Usually DPF are going bad when u use a car improperly. They don't like short run's with cold engine. They work best for long distances at constant rpm's (2500). There are 2 types of DPF, ones who need replacement and ones who regenerate themself. With the first one you'r out off luck usually they need to be replaced but with the second ones a 40 min drive at 2,500 - 3,000 rpm's in the third will quire it.

[Texas149]

Thanks for the post!:rock:I know the applications in which these set-ups are used vary greatly. The main direction I was hoping this thread would take is for the heavy duty applications. Heavy trucks, Power generation, etc. In the on-highway trucks the cure isn't so simple as to cruise it @ high rpm. Engine loads and speeds and other variables play a big role. We can see this is more evident as these systems are being refined over and over!

[rp1210a]

Manual/Forced Regen is the key before problems arise

[Texas149]

Is it that you mean forced regens are the means to prevent problems from arising or that they can cause problems with these systems?

[Floyd]

Forced regeneration is carried out normally using diagnostic equipment. If your talking truck applications and your having lots of trouble with this system, then it sound like you need to speak to the manufacturer to see if there is a software update for the engine ECU/DPF system!

[rp1210a]

Forced/Manual regens are the way to prevent some of the problems. Depending on driving habits the conditions for running the regen during normal drive may never be correct so it just wont run or not run long enough. Some trucks let you run a manual keygen using a button on the dash. Sometimes if the DPF is too far clogged the manual regun button wont work and you will need to force it via the oem soft.

[Texas149]

Forced/Manual regens are the way to prevent some of the problems. Depending on driving habits the conditions for running the regen during normal drive may never be correct so it just wont run or not run long enough. Some trucks let you run a manual keygen using a button on the dash. Sometimes if the DPF is too far clogged the manual regun button wont work and you will need to force it via the oem soft.
Right on M8! Lighter duty loads and short in city hauls won't let the DOC reach optimal temps for a sufficient duration to acheive a successful burn...Depending on the zone conditions of the DPF, some trucks will only allow a parked regen if a certain zone (zone as in filter buildup state) is acheived. I have seen bad injectors overfuel and crack the DOC and leave the truck crippled once the DPF zone reaches severe levels. I think I seen an outfit who manufactures "aftermarket" DPF's which incorporate a different design than current filters employ. Instead of the "wall" flow, it is a pass thru design. Less restrictive and still meets oem/epa standards. A bit pricey 2RC but I'll try to find 'em again.

[RSwire]

Thanks Texas149 for starting this thread. The company I work for is starting to get more of these vehicles in so any info i can aquire about them is wonderful. What ever happened to the good old days of streight pipes bellowing smoke and jake-brakes rattling windows.

[Texas149]

Your welcome bud. The same thing is happening to me. Trucks can't just sit and wait till the dealers have time to get to 'em. I'm the epitome of "On the job training"! Its really shifting gears in the industry. Now more turning some screws to roll the black smoke. R.I.P. to all those Small/Big Cams and B models. Say hello to the the New School. Keep up or get left. NOT ME I TELL YA!!!! Wish someone would bring me an old 16v149 2cycle detroit to rebuild. Those were the days my friend. :rock:
Back on topic....had a MBE 4000 come in. Propane truck. Active burns are disabled so manuals are the only way for this application. Ran through diagnostics; no codes. Will initiate regen and run indefinately. Noticed no response from Fuel Doser and Intake throttle valve during burn. Bingo! Ran doser routine and checked to be functional. Ran Intake throttle valve routine and showed to be functional. Hmmm. What the heck? Turned ignition off and couldn't hear the Intake valve "sweep" closed. So....I then removed the top cover off of the module on the valve assembly. There it was! Plastic junk! One of the teeth on the plastic gear broke off and lodged in the mesh of the mating gear and locked it up in the full open position. Oh yeah that part is on national backorder. :banghead:

[dafdiagnos]

i take it that you are on about the 'wonderful' world of scr - selective catalytic reduction using adblue, with the stainless/ titanium injectors etc. nothing but trouble

[rudamie]

Sweet thread.....! Gents also remember ultra low sulfer diesel is a must. Becareful that you don't pick up bad fuel. Make sure the pumps has a sticker that says Ultra Low Sulfer. If your not sure dont fill up there. Small towns my have old fuel. The Particulet Trap (P-Traps) will plug with particulet matter with a quickness. If you feels the truck slugish. Hook up a merc monometer to an exhaust port in front of the P-Trap area, and check how many inches of back pressure is present? Make sure the engine back pressure is with in specs. I would keep a spare P-Trap on hand, drain the fuel.

Woot Woot.....! Share On Gents

[renesis]

i take it that you are on about the 'wonderful' world of scr - selective catalytic reduction using adblue, with the stainless/ titanium injectors etc. nothing but trouble

Yes the wonderful SCR system is causing alot of headaches in my area whereby the UREA doser pump will choke. I'm in a tropical country (temperatures around 30C, so no freezing). Cummins service dealers will shift the blame to the OEM for improper installation...etc

Replacing the UREA doser pump is the only solution, and even after that an ECM recalibration is required to restore power back after the derate.

Oh and did I mention the failed exhaust catalysts? That costs a bomb to replace if they are no longer within the warranty period!

[MDR72]

live in US and scr is in full swing here can't wait for the cold. lots of problems with doser fuel injector still plugging, and lately lots of nox sensor failures,cunnims replaces and reflashes ecm to repair. still trying to get answer on exactly how much "monkey piss" these are to use. have several locals who have scr one get 3.8 mpg and has used 150 gal "piss" to 20000 miles. lots of factors to consider, but still very costly.

[hercamp]

well...just my experience...same of mdr72..the cost of parts ..make the trucks owner doesnt want pay to boy with laptop that try to diagnostic ecm or sensors problems..dealers try to get money from low cost parts and bad dpf sistems ..in the first 2 years runn so nice but after 3 or more years start a lot of problems ...exhaust temp sensors...delta presure...egr positions ...this one so common in isx?s...the low power in 60?series ...and sucks performance of mbe 4000 ...with particulars pld pumps bad responce and low torq in engine and many many ...else..

[talmadge]

if you cant force a parked regen with the software, you can try to blow the catalyst ( the front half)out with compressed air sometimes that works, only takes few mins. to try.

[dieselman77]

I live in new england , usa and there are lots of problems with the urea up here as well im waiting for the cold to really come and start freezing everything up and then who will they blame for the failures also cummins claims that the urea gave them 7-8% increase in fuel economy thats why they even considered using it with the egr sounds like a bunch of bulls@#t to me if your sayin only gettting less than 4 mpg

[renesis]

I live in new england , usa and there are lots of problems with the urea up here as well im waiting for the cold to really come and start freezing everything up and then who will they blame for the failures also cummins claims that the urea gave them 7-8% increase in fuel economy thats why they even considered using it with the egr sounds like a bunch of bulls@#t to me if your sayin only gettting less than 4 mpg

hi which engine are using using the scr with? If we could get the ecfg/e2m file for this engine in Calterm we could possibly disable the SCR system or disable the OBD torque derate to 0% instead of 60%/70%.

[MDR72]

in the us cm2250 have scr i've seen dpf removed from cm876 also egr and vgt but have to use worked turbo

[ServiceManager]

In the US, Alot of the Inernational Maxxforce engines you cannot perform a computer manual regen yet, yet is the key word. We see alot of dirty AFI's on the international engines. The cummins ISL engines in the Transit Buses are causing major aftertreatment issues. We replace DPF and Doc's all the time in the transit buses. The buses are stop and go all the time. Running all day but not on the highway all that much.

Tip> if you are not a dealer, keep checking back with your dealer to see if there are any new calibration updates to try to correct some of these failures.
You need to take care of all this under warranty now, because when you are out of warranty you are talking some very expensive repairs.

Good thread.

[ServiceManager]

also remember that in some cases regening too much will crack the dpf.

[dieselman77]

Thank you for the offer to fix the calibration with calterm but if you get caught messing with the emissions/aftertreatment on truck you can get fined $50,000 and i dont want to take that chance its not worth the boss is not going to pay the fine he will not pay for the software so i have to provide all of it myself and he will just point the finger at me

[renesis]

hi dieselman77,

It is an offence in my country as well to mess with the emission, there have been owners caught tempering with the aftertreatment and fined.

I believe in a way, that SCR does provide for cleaner air, for our generation and the future generations. it would be good if a more reliable SCR system can be used. The failure rate of SCR system here is 10 in 10 !

[pbateman]

Texas I know what you mean about having issues with the dpf filters. Where I work at we experience the same issues time and time again. But we have found a lot of the issues being the drivers shutting down the regn. switch or poor grade of fuel which clogs the first stage of the filter. I bet if you were to pull one apart you would find out that the first stage filter is plugged. Just to let you know a little secret for the warranty issues all they do is pull the first stage filter off and blow it out with air. We have started doing this ourselves and have found that the poor grade of fuel issues and over treatment of fuel to will cause the first stage to clog up. so now we just pull the first stage and blow them out with air and this seems to help for the time being.:champions:

[dieselmech32]

Is there such a thing as good fuel anymore? We have had several trucks and pickups in the shop for dpf problems. First stage filters clogged, poor performance due to restricted fuel filters, and the list just keeps going. We have even pulled fuel samples and done specific gravity test to check fuel quality. It is so bad that it is amazing that some of them even run.
Everyone is so concerned with making the engines run cleaner, that they have overlooked one thing that is very important: fuel quality!

[Texas149]

DieselMech is correct. Especially for over-the-road haul trucks. Different grade fuels being introduced is killing these systems. Starting by trashing the injectors which in turn hammers the DOC's. It is also true that using compressed air to blow out the clogged element helps, albeit a temporary fix not a solution.

[talmadge]

I blow out the front part out all the time on the side of the road.works good it only takes about 30 mins to do. cheaper then calling a tow truck, just to have it towed to a dealer, and they always blame the driver anyway.

[mechmanalice]

The doser pump has had about 2-3 mods to my Knowledge I have worked with them on Buses for the last 5 years 1682 code blocked nozzel or the fav now is a 2771 or 2772 also the mil lamp comes on not just for SCR faults but overheats and loss of ignition all sorts which can be quite confusing with drivers because certain faults required it to run through certain tests before going off and most garages just ignore it, On the upside the ISBe 4-6 has been a whole lot better than the ISC with the CAPS pump. Oh had a few loom faults causing Inlet manifold sensor fault to come up this has been poorly manufac looms. if we speak about EGR which I have had on Scanias had mega probs and the price of the variable Geomtry turbo is in the region of ?8000 not cheap!!!!

[ricz]

The only problems I've seen so far is medium duty trucks (mostly delivery trucks) that do alot of idling, so the exhaust don't get hot enough to do active regen, and the drivers don't do a passive regen ( and they ignore the checke engine light). and the dpf gets clugged up. On cummins insite you can reset the dpf when you have a stop engine light becuase of a plugged dpf ( when its severe it wont let you regen). When you resset it it will change it to just a check engine light that way you can do a passive regen.
I have seen mechanics change a dpf because of a bad differential pressure sensor.
Also urea freezes at around 11F it separates into ammonia at around 135, and its corrosive to aluminum.
Hope this helps you ..(sorry for my bad english)

[talmadge]

When its real cold out and you try do a parked regen the fan cools the the engine to much,the temp drops below 170 or never warms up to 170, (at fan soilnoid) connect air supply to the fan air line to disengage fan, just keep a eye on the temp when regen. afterwards reconnect back up at fan soilnoid.

[atetruckrepair]

also to let you guys know i find when you have a plugged first stage dpf and you clean it also look at the differential pressure sensor ports they will likely be plugged as well i clean the dpf and ports at the same time

[kwtech]

Anybody have info on deleting DPF's, which cals, flash files to use, I know some that have got it done, dont know where, thanks

[justme84]

Most that I've seen done had ECM sent out to get them reflashed. But I see certain files on Incal are for Mexico and Australia and in the notes it says no Aftertreatment. They MAY work although there is a considerable risk in trying.
There are a few places in the US and Canada that will Program your ECM for a fee.

[kwtech]

Yes I know, ive contemplated trying a Mexico/austrilia file to see, just checking if someone had done it

if I try Ill post results

[MDR72]

mex/aust seems as if it will work checked ser# cross ref sensors and pins all the same but never tried it, i have an extra ecm and will try to see if it works, let you know.

[bynow3]

waitin' for good news from you m8

[jctech]

If you are using CM570 ECMs on ISX engines, try QSX15 cals, there is no aftertreatment on QSX15's. And there are some big standard cals, look at CPL 8587.

[renesis]

can I use QSB CM850 cals on ISBe CM850?
or even ISB CM850 (without aftertreatment)?

[manimal]

When its real cold out and you try do a parked regen the fan cools the the engine to much,the temp drops below 170 or never warms up to 170, (at fan soilnoid) connect air supply to the fan air line to disengage fan, just keep a eye on the temp when regen. afterwards reconnect back up at fan soilnoid.

EPA07 engines use engine fan to provide some means of engine load - I'm located in canada, never had an issue with excessive cold temperatures preventing regen - themostat should keep engine operating temp above 170.

[talmadge]

I have had it happen twice this last winter. why tow a truck for a regen. One thuck had a bad doser valve and the other the driver was new and kept hitting the inhibit switch both engines were cold by time I got there and did the repair. They refused to warm up, when I hit the regen the fan kicked in and just would not warm up. This trick helped me.

[manimal]

interesting - what was the year / make / model of engine and what software level was it? I know detroits, 07 to 10, use engine fan as source of load to increase DOC in temp to minimum 540F before dosing, not sure about cummins though.

[jctech]

can I use QSB CM850 cals on ISBe CM850?
or even ISB CM850 (without aftertreatment)?

If the ECM pinouts are the same, there are differences in sensors and fuel pressure (injectors) between QSB 5.9 and ISB Euro 4 (QSB 6.7), Euro 4 runs at a higher pressure.

[renesis]

If the ECM pinouts are the same, there are differences in sensors and fuel pressure (injectors) between QSB 5.9 and ISB Euro 4 (QSB 6.7), Euro 4 runs at a higher pressure.

yes jctech, thanks for your information. I believe most pinouts are the same, I am comparing a normal ISB CM850 and ISBe4 CM850... Probably a QSB and ISBe4 will have more differences?
Fuel pressure is definitely different I guess.

[pbateman]

Hello fellow Dk friends! Hey got an issue with an ISX The DPF system keeps throwing a fault code and the unit was replaced and all the temp sensors cleaned and all. truck ran for about 100 miles and just started throwing a fault code that it needs to be regened have done it several times and code wont go away and the filter 1st and 2nd stage are new. Any ideas would be greatly appericated!!!!!

[pbateman]

If anyone ha time now to read my last post I need some dire help here I've I have goen from one truck having issues wanting to regen all the time and have replaced everything on the truck dealing with the reng portion. the fault will clear out for about 100 miles then start acting up again and Im ready to pull my hair out cant get a straight answer from cummins so anyone who has experienced this any thoughts or help would greatly be appreciated. Thanks in advance!:giveup::giveup::giveup::giveup:

[han2542]

hello guys have a problem with a c7 cat the regen sistem keeps givin me codes that it doesnt ignite i cheked the sparkplug on the sistem and its working just fine as is the electrical sistem that starts it keep getting code 3473-31
and it keeps telling me that it canot do regen because of ignite fault please any help would be really thanked as always thank you for all youre help
han2542

[IYA]

Hello fellow Dk friends! Hey got an issue with an ISX The DPF system keeps throwing a fault code and the unit was replaced and all the temp sensors cleaned and all. truck ran for about 100 miles and just started throwing a fault code that it needs to be regened have done it several times and code wont go away and the filter 1st and 2nd stage are new. Any ideas would be greatly appericated!!!!!
Need to know what year ISX and what fault code your re talking about.

[pbateman]

IYA the year of the truck is 2007 and the fault code is 2639. It is an active fault code and will go inactive as soon as the truck is shut down and once you restart it / it will take a few minutes for the fault to back active and show that the truck requires a regen and you do that and the fault will clear again and just kick right back on after it runs for a bit. As I posted in one of my earlier post the 1st and 2nd stage are all new the temp sensors are new and everything else was pulled apart and cleaned that had anything remotely to do with the regen system.Also I can mention this is on an automatic truck.

[Texas149]

It seems as though the Pressure sensors are not working correctly. Do you have insite to monitor the dpf readings? Code 2639 is DPF differential pressure valid but above normal range. Stated temp sensors are new, are the pressure sensors new also? May need to check resistance in these circuits.


If all else fails throw that junk canister in the trash!!! ; )

[IYA]

You need to monitor temps when truck is in regen to see if your doser injector is working and the doc is not face plugged.When that happens you dont build enough heat during regen to burn off soot in the dpf.

[pbateman]

Texas And IYA thanks for the input . Will hook back to the truck with insite and monitor the temps during a regen and see what happens from there. I appreciate the help and information. :cheers:

[RAULIN]

I WENT TO TRAINING FOR ISUZU TRUCKS AND THEY TELL USS AFTER THE REGEN IS A MUST TO REPLACE THE OIL CAUSE THEY DUMP TO MUCH EXTRA FUEL IN THE CYLINDERS THAT SOME FUEL GO IN TO THE OIL AND CAREFULL NO JUST DO THE PARK REGEN CHANGE THE OIL TO,THEY SAID THEY CHANGE THE DESIGN THEY PUT A LINE TO THE EXHAUST TO DUMP THE FUEL IN THE EXHAUST SIDE NO TO THE ENGINE SIDE,TO ELIMINATE THE OIL CHANGE SO OFTEN,

[RAULIN]

ANOTHER TIP WITH CUMMINS ENGINES SOMETIME YOU CANT PEWRFORM REGEN CAUSE YOU REACH THE MAXIMUN ALLOW USING THE INSITE PROGRAN GO TO MAINTENANCE OF DPF FILTER OR RESET THE COUNTER AND RETURN TO DO THE REGEN REMEMBER NEED TO BE IN WORKING TEMPEARATURE,BRAKE RELEASE SIGNAL,AND CLUTCH APLIED SIGNAL,IF YOU DONT MEET THOSE SIGNALS YOU DONT GO NO WERE,ANOTHER TRICK IF YOU DONT HAVE ANY OF THOSE SIGNALS GO TO PARAMETERS CHANGE THAT SIGNAL PARAMETERS TO UNABLE RETURN TO DO THE REGEN AND PERFORM REGEN DONT FORGET AFTER YOU FINISH THE REGEN GO BACK IN THE PARAMETERS AND PUT THE ORIGINAL VALUE OF THAT PARAMETER ABLE THE SIGNAL THAT WORKS FOR ME ,

[r3gill]

Most that I've seen done had ECM sent out to get them reflashed. But I see certain files on Incal are for Mexico and Australia and in the notes it says no Aftertreatment. They MAY work although there is a considerable risk in trying.
There are a few places in the US and Canada that will Program your ECM for a fee.


Did you ever try this? I have a freind with cummins isx cm871 and his warranty just expired. lots of issues with plugging dpf's and stuff. If there is a way of bypassing dpf crap with just a different flash file it will work wonders.

[r3gill]

common guys anyone?

[Texas149]

How's that truck doin PBATEMAN?

[r3gill]

need some more ideas for how to bypass the filter.. without buying expensive kits from ebay etc. These systems are nothing but problems.

[jctech]

need some more ideas for how to bypass the filter.. without buying expensive kits from ebay etc. These systems are nothing but problems.

very difficult to bypass the filter, the ECM needs to see a difference in temperature between in and out, it also needs to see the temperature respond to increase and decrease in engine load.
The ECM needs to see a backpressure in the DPF within a certain window, it needs to see a pressure difference between in and out and it needs to see the backpressure change with engine load. very difficult to meet all this outside of the ECM.

[MDR72]

Some cm871 flash files are marked no aftertreatment mexico and aust. Have researched these engines and all have egr and precoolers but no dpf fliters. Have one downloaded in a spare ecm but never had a chance to try.:viking:

[justme84]

Did you ever try this? I have a freind with cummins isx cm871 and his warranty just expired. lots of issues with plugging dpf's and stuff. If there is a way of bypassing dpf crap with just a different flash file it will work wonders.

No, i never tried, most customers with trucks that new are hesitant to have someone outside of cummins try stuff like that on their trucks.

[justme84]

very difficult to bypass the filter, the ECM needs to see a difference in temperature between in and out, it also needs to see the temperature respond to increase and decrease in engine load.
The ECM needs to see a backpressure in the DPF within a certain window, it needs to see a pressure difference between in and out and it needs to see the backpressure change with engine load. very difficult to meet all this outside of the ECM.

Has anyone had a look at an ecm that's had a dpf delete done on it? Wondering how they get past all the parameters.

[r3gill]

I do have one CM870 spare ECM.. I would like to have a spare cm871 to try this. Will go look for one in junk yard. Engines that they made in 2008-2010 are worst for dpf plugging. guys have more downtime to the truck then they actually haul.

[r3gill]

Has anyone had a look at an ecm that's had a dpf delete done on it? Wondering how they get past all the parameters.

yes I have seen one cm871 with all the egr and dpf stuff deleted, and it had old school cm570 ecm with wires around it like a bird nest. i guess who ever did it didn't do a very good job wiring the thing. I am positive someone on this forum know all about bypassing these stupid things with some flash files and removing the dpf completely and installing a regular muffler. ie if ecm doesnt even read those sensors on the dpf calatalyst its not even thinking that the truck has dpf system. JUST ABOUT PROGRAMING from my point of view.

[jctech]

yes I have seen one cm871 with all the egr and dpf stuff deleted, and it had old school cm570 ecm with wires around it like a bird nest. i guess who ever did it didn't do a very good job wiring the thing. I am positive someone on this forum know all about bypassing these stupid things with some flash files and removing the dpf completely and installing a regular muffler. ie if ecm doesnt even read those sensors on the dpf calatalyst its not even thinking that the truck has dpf system. JUST ABOUT PROGRAMING from my point of view.

You can buy them on ebay

[mang5087]

yes I have seen one cm871 with all the egr and dpf stuff deleted, and it had old school cm570 ecm with wires around it like a bird nest. i guess who ever did it didn't do a very good job wiring the thing. I am positive someone on this forum know all about bypassing these stupid things with some flash files and removing the dpf completely and installing a regular muffler. ie if ecm doesnt even read those sensors on the dpf calatalyst its not even thinking that the truck has dpf system. JUST ABOUT PROGRAMING from my point of view.


you can delete egr-dpf with calterm. best to
upload, change enable flags then download to
ecm.

[pbateman]

Hey fellow Dk friends. Well I've posted several issues on here with dpf issues and found some things out dont know if anyone has ever run into this issue but just wanted to share with everyone. Had to trucks call for a regen all the time and were drinking coolant like it was koolaid. Well after pulling apart and much digging I found out the aftertreatment burner had been leaking coolant by it and it had crystalized and this is what was causing all the havoc with the regen issues. Need less to say had to replace 1st and 2nd stage due to contamination and had to replace the aftertreatment injector. So if you ever run into this issue just a bit of good info to share and if you have run into this then you know what I'm talking about and the head aches it will cause you. Have a good one and hopefully well keep getting more good info here on the thread.:cheers:

[IYA]

Hey fellow Dk friends. Well I've posted several issues on here with dpf issues and found some things out dont know if anyone has ever run into this issue but just wanted to share with everyone. Had to trucks call for a regen all the time and were drinking coolant like it was koolaid. Well after pulling apart and much digging I found out the aftertreatment burner had been leaking coolant by it and it had crystalized and this is what was causing all the havoc with the regen issues. Need less to say had to replace 1st and 2nd stage due to contamination and had to replace the aftertreatment injector. So if you ever run into this issue just a bit of good info to share and if you have run into this then you know what I'm talking about and the head aches it will cause you. Have a good one and hopefully well keep getting more good info here on the thread.:cheers:
Good to hear you figured it out but did the coolant damage the doc and dpf?Usualy you just fix the problem with coolant in exhaust stream then run a regen.Itsmoke white for a little while then go away.Ive change a lot of egr cooler on 6.7 isbs for leaking coolant in intake system of course then gets in exhaust stream.After the cooler is replaced i run a regen then is all done

[IYA]

How about a calibration to delete egr in 870 ecms.Ive tried looking for mexico calibration but none found in none of the ecm part numbers.Ive got a few customers running with the egr turned off but with check engine light on and I would like to turn off their light.Is a qsx cal going to be the only option?What you guys think?

[IYA]

Never mind I just checked and qsx uses 570 ecm.

[jctech]

How about a calibration to delete egr in 870 ecms.Ive tried looking for mexico calibration but none found in none of the ecm part numbers.Ive got a few customers running with the egr turned off but with check engine light on and I would like to turn off their light.Is a qsx cal going to be the only option?What you guys think?

The EGR and VGT are connected to each other in the cal, the VGT uses EGR valve position information to controll the VGT actuator. If the VGT stays fully open, you will have a low boost fault code after a period of light load running, if the VGT stays fully closed you will have low power (restricted exhaust under medium to high load). The VGT must be controled to operate correctly, this needs EGR active.
The only answer is to replace the turbo with a wastegated unit (QSX 15 size), and then disable EGR and VGT in the cal.

[IYA]

Thanks for the response.I understand how egr and vgt work togather.Its just that I can not find a calibration in cm870 that doesnt have egr.My question is there an easier way to get rid of egr other than swaping to cm570 system which requires new ecm,harness,sensors,ect.

[jctech]

Thanks for the response.I understand how egr and vgt work togather.Its just that I can not find a calibration in cm870 that doesnt have egr.My question is there an easier way to get rid of egr other than swaping to cm570 system which requires new ecm,harness,sensors,ect.

All the ISX engines from after signature 600 (CM870 and 871 2150 etc) have EGR

[donniemnemonic]

All the ISX engines from after signature 600 (CM870 and 871 2150 etc) have EGR

Hi all.
Well have an ISX model number ST450 with a CM870 ecm in the shop that has two active fault codes that spell out trouble with the egr valve and exhaust pressure sensor. Have managed to check all the wiring to and from the ecm and this all checks out good using the insite troubleshooter and wiring diagrams. I have however removed the egr valve and exhaust pressure sensor but am failing to locate a replacement egr valve in my area cause these engines are new to us here. Was considering taking the egr valve apart cause it looks servicable but am not sure of the following:
1. Will I not damage the water seals and end up with a leaking valve and
2. What voltage is supplied by the ecm to the egr valve motor.
If anyone can help with these questions and maybe a service manual or a link to 1 for this engine I would be most greatful cause I don't want to end up with a truck stuck in the shop cause of a damaged egr valve because I believe the owner has been running it this way for over a year now.
Many thanks as always
Donniemnemonic

[IYA]

All the ISX engines from after signature 600 (CM870 and 871 2150 etc) have EGR
Thanks for the response JC

[IYA]

Hi all.
Well have an ISX model number ST450 with a CM870 ecm in the shop that has two active fault codes that spell out trouble with the egr valve and exhaust pressure sensor. Have managed to check all the wiring to and from the ecm and this all checks out good using the insite troubleshooter and wiring diagrams. I have however removed the egr valve and exhaust pressure sensor but am failing to locate a replacement egr valve in my area cause these engines are new to us here. Was considering taking the egr valve apart cause it looks servicable but am not sure of the following:
1. Will I not damage the water seals and end up with a leaking valve and
2. What voltage is supplied by the ecm to the egr valve motor.
If anyone can help with these questions and maybe a service manual or a link to 1 for this engine I would be most greatful cause I don't want to end up with a truck stuck in the shop cause of a damaged egr valve because I believe the owner has been running it this way for over a year now.
Many thanks as always
Donniemnemonic
Why don t you post the fault codes you re getting along with the counts and some body can help you easier.The egr valve is not serviceable.Monitor the exhaust pressure with insite and you can see if its stuck in range which is usualy caused by a bad sensor.Pay close attention to the pins for sensor as they corrode alot.

[rigos42]

hello im work on ISL CM2150 and CM 2250 CUMMINS ENGINES They have been a lot a troble about DPF but the warranty is over so we have yo star working on these engines but must of the troble is like DPF need to be clean and alot of update on the e.cm. some are like 20 updates on ecm must of the updates there are for DPF on calibration software.every month has new up dates for these engines. also some problem on fuel rail pressure sensor and actuator fuel sensor, and some injector but we have to keeing running.

[jctech]

Hi all.
Well have an ISX model number ST450 with a CM870 ecm in the shop that has two active fault codes that spell out trouble with the egr valve and exhaust pressure sensor. Have managed to check all the wiring to and from the ecm and this all checks out good using the insite troubleshooter and wiring diagrams. I have however removed the egr valve and exhaust pressure sensor but am failing to locate a replacement egr valve in my area cause these engines are new to us here. Was considering taking the egr valve apart cause it looks servicable but am not sure of the following:
1. Will I not damage the water seals and end up with a leaking valve and
2. What voltage is supplied by the ecm to the egr valve motor.
If anyone can help with these questions and maybe a service manual or a link to 1 for this engine I would be most greatful cause I don't want to end up with a truck stuck in the shop cause of a damaged egr valve because I believe the owner has been running it this way for over a year now.
Many thanks as always
Donniemnemonic

You can try taking an old EGR valve apart, most of the issues are not with the actual valve (seal area), but with the drive assembly.
You cannot get parts for the EGR valve through Cummins, but if you can identify the part you may be able to source parts from the original manafacturer, or from any parts supplier for bearings bushings pins etc.

With the EGR valve dissabled/missing you may get a fault code for exhaust pressure, as the ECM looks for a change in pressure as it commands the EGR valve position, you will also have a fault for the missing EGR valve position sensor.

[donniemnemonic]

You can try taking an old EGR valve apart, most of the issues are not with the actual valve (seal area), but with the drive assembly.
You cannot get parts for the EGR valve through Cummins, but if you can identify the part you may be able to source parts from the original manafacturer, or from any parts supplier for bearings bushings pins etc.

With the EGR valve dissabled/missing you may get a fault code for exhaust pressure, as the ECM looks for a change in pressure as it commands the EGR valve position, you will also have a fault for the missing EGR valve position sensor.

Hi m8.
Managed to test the drive assembly using an external battery and that seems okay. I however tested the position sensor and that seems to be where the problem lies cause I could not get a reading from it. After searching around for a replacement I failed to get 1 and ended up replacing the faulty sensor so the truck could go back on the road. These trucks are fairly new here so we are having difficulties with spare parts. Any help would be gratefully appreciated.
Regards
Donniemnemonic

[mang5087]

The EGR and VGT are connected to each other in the cal, the VGT uses EGR valve position information to controll the VGT actuator. If the VGT stays fully open, you will have a low boost fault code after a period of light load running, if the VGT stays fully closed you will have low power (restricted exhaust under medium to high load). The VGT must be controled to operate correctly, this needs EGR active.
The only answer is to replace the turbo with a wastegated unit (QSX 15 size), and then disable EGR and VGT in the cal.

Hello, jctech do you know what part number i would need
for ISX cm870 to QSX 15 size turbo wastegated unit?
i have tried different vendors no one can help without
turbo number. thanks for all your help.

[jctech]

Hello, jctech do you know what part number i would need
for ISX cm870 to QSX 15 size turbo wastegated unit?
i have tried different vendors no one can help without
turbo number. thanks for all your help.

The QSX 15 uses a Holset HX60W turbocharger.
all pre 2007 CPL's use the same service kit 4089970, this has a machined from solid compressor wheel, instead of a cast compressor wheel. You do not need a MFS compressor wheel for automotive duty cycles.
You could use 3598764, 3598765, 4025272, 4089298.

[jctech]

Download the holset turbocharger application database CD to break down these part numbers further to see the differences in the base turbochargers.


http://www.digital-kaos.co.uk/forums/f166/holset-turbocharger-application-database-167427/

[nycautodiags]

Hi:)
Could one of you Help me? Im trying to find out if its Possible to do a Forced Regeneration On International Trucks? I have all the Diagnostic Packages (Md32,ServiceMaxx,DLB,Navistar)...is there a year Specific model? or model Line that will be accept a Forced Regeneration? just want to be prepared.....my boss is considering a fleet contract with alot of International trucks in it? any help is greatly Appreciated.....thanx

[joes108]

Hi:)
Could one of you Help me? Im trying to find out if its Possible to do a Forced Regeneration On International Trucks? I have all the Diagnostic Packages (Md32,ServiceMaxx,DLB,Navistar)...is there a year Specific model? or model Line that will be accept a Forced Regeneration? just want to be prepared.....my boss is considering a fleet contract with alot of International trucks in it? any help is greatly Appreciated.....thanx

Their is two different ways to do a forced regen on a international the first way is to use servicemaxx and do the onboard filter cleanliness test under the test tab and engine running tests this works for the Max DT,9,10,11,13,. The other way for the Max DT,9,and 10 is 1. Open the Aftertreatment session. 2. Turn ignition on. 3. Disconnect the EGDP sensor and wait for egdp code to become active. 4. Reconnect the egdp sensor and wait for code to become inactive. 5. When egdp code becomes inactive click to erase it. 6. Start engine and hold to high idle (max). 7. monitor EGT 1, 2, 3 - they'll rise. 8. EGT 2 will climb higher than all at some point and will be followed by EGT 3; may go higher than 1000F. 9. Maintain high idle (max) and wait until temps come back down to around 800 or less.

[pbateman]

Hey Dk friends here is some info I stumbled across surfing! Hope it might be useful to someone.
Diesel Retrofits - DPF - Diesel Particulate Filters | Cummins West, Inc. (http://www.cumminswestinc.com/emissions/diesel-retrofits.html)

[mang5087]

hello, i have detroit VI MCM code 3719 DFP max soot level 5,
it will not do a regen. engine will only run a few minutes and
shut down. can someone please help. thanks to all

[pbateman]

not sure about detroit but if the program is anything like cummins insite you should be able to force a regen through the program or maybe even doing a hard reset of the unit. like I said not sure how the detroit program is but I know with insite you can do this hope this helps

[ddmech]

Dont know if it will help but I had the same problem with a ddec 6 mercedes.We took the dpf apart and cleaned it.Choked completely up.Afterwards did a regen and had no problems since.

[jackalfa]

Question: The delta p sensor in a cummins engine, can be calibrated with Insite?
Please, if so, how to do it?

thanks

[jctech]

Question: The delta p sensor in a cummins engine, can be calibrated with Insite?
Please, if so, how to do it?

thanks

You can monitor the pressures using Insite, but there is no adjustment/calibration, either the delta pressure sensor, or the pipework to the DPF is damaged/failed, or there is an issue in the DPF that is causing the high/low pressure readings.
Disconnect the delta P sensor pipes from the DPF (but do not unplug) and let it read fresh air, monitor with the engine off, the two readings should be the same.

[moza]

I have a friend. fact without dpf calibration CM871 vgt
how can we make.

[MDR72]

Detroit VI need diddly software to perform forced regen, laptop must be hooked to engine to perform regen ECM has locked out regen with switches. Regen system has a problem possible doses valve is plugged or had one with low fuel pressure during regen, was a fuel pump. Just wondering if unit has excessive idle or city deliveries.

[pbateman]

mdr72 first off try removing the doser from exhaust. you don't have to disconnect coolant lines then remove the plate in it and clean out the carbon in the area where the doser sits this is a pretty common issue for detroits. once you do this install the doser back and then with dddl or ddrs go into service routines and click on DPF and perform a parked regen this should solve your issue.

[hoochyates]

I agree with pbateman 100%. Detroits are notorious for carbon buildup at the doser.

[donniemnemonic]

Hi m8s
Can some1 please assist with a wiring diagram for signature ISX cm870 part number 3683289.

Regards
Donniemnemonic

[johnamanda3]

hello guys my question is there anyway of blocking off the egr and dpf we have a 60 series that's just weak, fresh rebuild, only code is the flapper valve on the intake but its new and working. Also there are to small lines on front of the engine from the egr tube, theres a sensor plate there but the plug is missing, any ideas if this is the cause of low power and where could these wires be its like someone cut them off but I have no idea where. help please

[colh]

Hi All
Anyone in OZ dealing with DPF on cummins need someone knows there way round the system can send them the work. PM me if you can help have lots of blokes wanting to buy trucks but heat from DPF makes the downright dangerous in the conditions here.
Rgds All colh

[hercamp]

i can do dpf egr delete on most all cummins and detroits , only for people in dk

[colh]

With cummins you can swap us and aus cals i accidently put us cal with dpf in non dpf aus truck still ran fine but got fault codes dpf pressures,sensors etc not in specification,so reckon you can put aus cal in and remove dpf or dummy it and should work.Trucks with dpf dont sell well S/H out here everyone avoids them.