Motor alignment

[Philbeardmore]

Hi guys,

I'm really struggling aligning my dish (this is te first time I've ever done it). I've made sure my mounting pole is 100% plumb and that my dish is mounted central to my motors arm (fully aligned). The lattitude is set on the motor bracket and the angle is also set on te dish bracket (based on the values in the motor booklet which also ties in with the vales provided by dishpointer). I've set the lattitude and longitude in the receiver and set it to 0.8 degrees (Thor). I've tried rotating the motor assembly (plus dish) aroun slowly in the direction shown on dishpointer but don't seem to get anything. Am I doing something wrong?

I'm relying on the receiver (spiderbox) to show my signal/quality) but I've read the metres on the boxes at prett in accurate. Should I buy a meter?

I'm struggling so any help wou be greatly appreciated

Thanks
Phil

[ramjet]

Hi guys,

I'm really struggling aligning my dish (this is te first time I've ever done it). I've made sure my mounting pole is 100% plumb and that my dish is mounted central to my motors arm (fully aligned). The lattitude is set on the motor bracket and the angle is also set on te dish bracket (based on the values in the motor booklet which also ties in with the vales provided by dishpointer). I've set the lattitude and longitude in the receiver and set it to 0.8 degrees (Thor). I've tried rotating the motor assembly (plus dish) aroun slowly in the direction shown on dishpointer but don't seem to get anything. Am I doing something wrong?

I'm relying on the receiver (spiderbox) to show my signal/quality) but I've read the metres on the boxes at prett in accurate. Should I buy a meter?

I'm struggling so any help wou be greatly appreciated

Thanks
Phil

I hope you have chosen usals after setting your longitude and latitude on the spiderbox ? this will send the motor to the correct place for your location

ensure the latitude is set on the motor too , and lock it up

install a spiderbox channel list and select thor and choose bbc world and then move the motor itself left or right on the pole , and also move the dish up or down until you get bbc world showing on a tv monitor

then press info twice and tweak until you get the best signal and quality on the green and blue bars, then lock the motor and dish , and test 42e and 30w

tweaking slightly should allow you to get all the satellites using usals

the main pointers are to ensure the latitude is set correctly on the motor and locked , and your location set in usals , with the pole being plumb and no obstructions in front of it blocking signals. it needs a good line of sight from south east to south west

if you had been in ireland use 5w for alignment , and tweak on 4w , checking 30w and 42e as well

the chances are that the dish elevation is incorrect if you get nothing for bbc world

[Philbeardmore]

Thanks Ramjet - ive set the box to usals but haven't loaded a channel list. Will try in he morning and let you know how I get on. Thanks again

Phil

[ramjet]

Thanks Ramjet - ive set the box to usals but haven't loaded a channel list. Will try in he morning and let you know how I get on. Thanks again

Phil

even if you had wanted to scan yourself , for alignment put a channel list in , set usals again for your location , select bbc world or the music channel which are both fta on 0.8w and ensure the motor moves when you select 0.8w and one of those 2 channels

that way when you are on the money the channel will pop up on your tv, you can use the spiderbox signal bars for checking with no problems , bearing in mind this way you are looking for an active transponder which you werent with no channel list

once you have set it up using somebody elses list , either stick with that list or factory reset and scan your own in - your choice

[dick b]

Thanks Ramjet - ive set the box to usals but haven't loaded a channel list. Will try in he morning and let you know how I get on. Thanks again

Phil

this list may help you set up even if its not to your taste its an HD list from a spider box 7000, there is a FTA channel set at channel 0001 on the following sats(checked all working just now) 30West,0.8West,13East,16East,19.2East,23.5East,28. 2East & 39East. re-check your co-ordinates if you load this list.

[Philbeardmore]

Thanks Dick B - Can I use this list as Ive only got the Spiderbox 5000 SD?

[ramjet]

Thanks Dick B - Can I use this list as Ive only got the Spiderbox 5000 SD?

no m8

you need a 5000 SD list for that box , all the rest are HD and use the HD list

its a shame you did not mention this in post 1 !

[ramjet]

found this compass SD list from nov 2011 that will help you get started

satellites as follows

1 west
5 east
13 east
16 east
19 east
28 east
39 east

Favourites have Dummy markers in to indicate Satellite "Position" and "Packages" cleared channels belong to.

as follows

Ethernet Sports
Ethernet A
Ethernet B
Ucas

[Philbeardmore]

Thanks guys.

Something strange is happening or im doing something wrong. I set my motor to 0, fire up the spiderbox, input my latt/longitude and set the motor to USALS then upload the channel list. I then select BBC news on Thor and the motor moves (which i'd expect it to do). Only when looking at the motor it doesnt appear to have move to 1w - Its actually moved east. Then when I select Astra 28.2 it picks some other bizarre locationg (going by the readings on the motor).

I still havent got a lock on Thor so maybe this could be the root of the problems.

Is it that difficult to get a signal coming through? Do I have to tap the dish and motor round millimetre by millimetre?

I'm struggling here so any help would be greatly appreciated. I'm worried I've got some duff kit (TM2600 motor, Inverto Black Ultra LNB, Technomate dish and Spiderbox SD5000).

Thanks
Phil

[mdt]

reset your motor when its on zero and then check lat/long, reboot and then try, regards mdt

[ramjet]

there is nothing wrong with your kit

once this channel list is in your box , set the usals longitude and latitude to your location , then send the box to 0.8 west

at this point it wont move to 1 west but will be a few degrees away from this , which is normal , unless your longitude was 0.00 (the greenwich meridian)

the point about using usals is that the spiderbox will send the motor to the correct place for thor, assuming you have put in your correct longitude and latitude

if you use diseqc v1.2 you will have to work this marking on the motor out yourself, using a formulae

so you set the spiderbox on bbc world and press info twice to bring up the 2 bars showing the signal and quality

then move the motor on its mount left or right , and the dish up or down, until you find bbc world

do not alter your latitude on your motor, leave it at 54n or whatever you are using

once you get thor you will see bbc world pop up and the signal and quality bars will light up, then you can fine tune it and temporarily lock it up

ps:- the longitude and latitude should have been put into the spiderbox AFTER loading the channel list , not before

[Philbeardmore]

Fantastic. Thanks guys. I'll reset my spiderbox to factory settings, set the motor to zero then reset it. I'll then upload the channel list, set lattitude/longitude then try and move the assembly to find BBC news.

My motor settings for lattitude is locked at 54 and the dish setting is around 23 (if I remember correctly) as directed in the motors guide.

Will give it a try tomorrow. Do I have to go millimetre by millimetre when trying to find the sat? And am I right in thinking that when I find it, I can tweak the dish up or down to improve quality?

Thanks again guys - really appreciated

[ramjet]

yes , you only use small movements , and once found peak the signal by checking it left and right and up and down by a few mm only

I think the problem here is that you seem to think the markings on the motor relate to the satellite positions , they dont unless you are on the greenwich meridian and 0.00 longitude

so if you are in say newcastle your longitude is 1.4 west and 54.6 north for latitude , so your due south would be 1.4 west and not zero like london. and if you were in york it would be thor that is due south of you at 1 west and 54 north

the zero on the motor points due south, and the other markers show the degrees west or east of due south (not the satellites - unless you were on 0.0 degrees as I said earlier)

I am assuming here that your longitude is not 0.00 , so the markings on the motor are not relevant to the satellite positions as they are determined by greenwich in london

[Philbeardmore]

Ramjet, you're spot on with your assumptions. I was thinking that my motor should read the same location as the satellite, but it all makes sense now. When I find Thor the motor will not necessarily read 0.8 degrees however 0 degrees will always be true south.

Thanks for the tip about pressing inf twice btw. :-)

I'm a newbie but feel I've learnt a lot so far - so much more to learn though

Cheers
Phil

[ramjet]

Ramjet, you're spot on with your assumptions. I was thinking that my motor should read the same location as the satellite, but it all makes sense now. When I find Thor the motor will not necessarily read 0.8 degrees however 0 degrees will always be true south.

Thanks for the tip about pressing inf twice btw. :-)

I'm a newbie but feel I've learnt a lot so far - so much more to learn though

Cheers
Phil

excellent

that idea would work for say hull at 0.3w , or scarborough , or any other place on or near the greenwich meridian

but for most of us the markings on ther motor bear no resemblance to the satellite positions over the equator

[Nutsandbolts]

Hi. I have installed lots of TM2600 motors and the way they works is as follows:
a) The motor has a dial like a timer. It has 0 in the middle and 1 to 70 on either side of the 0. The figures go up in steps of 10 ie 10 20 30 etc. These figures are used by USALS to locate the satellites at their given positions. For example when you tell USALS to go to 30 west it will move the dial and stop when it reaches 30 on the dial.The west satellites are to the left of the 0 ie anti clockwise and the east satellites are to the right of the 0 ie clockwise. When you are going east the dish will move to the left and when you are going west the dish will move to the right.
b) USALS uses your postcode figures to know which way to move your dish, for London it is 00.1W and 51.5N .
c) Also remember that USALS will only go to a satellite position as indicated in your menu. So make sure that all satellites you wish to pick up have the correct positions set.
d) A common problem for most people is that when they search for a satellite they dont have the correct TP ( or frequency). Always make sure you have a valid TP or channel for any satellite otherwise you will never find it.
e) It does not matter which satellite you look for first, the important thing is to find a satellite and then you can work out from there where you are. I always find that the satellites at 13 east, 19.2 east and 28.2 east are best to start with for the UK because they are so powerful and easier to locate and they are next door to each other. In reality all satellites are next door to each other
f) The way to find a satellite is simple ie do what i do. Make sure all cables are connected correctly and you have a green light on the motor. Using USALS set the motor to 0 by selecting GO TO REFERENCE in your motor menu. This will centralize the motor ie at point 0. If you have the dish already mounted on the motor tail make sure it is facing straight ahead and roughly central on the tail.Make sure dish is not pointing up or down but straight ahead. This way you will have motor and dish centralized at 0. Using USALS send the dish to a satellite ,in my case 28.2 . You can do this in two ways either from your SAT button on remote or using the GO TO option in motor menu. The dish should now move to the left heading for 28.2 east. When it reaches 28.2 the motor and dish will stop. Now comes the fun. Set the motor setting from USALS to OFF ( this will stop the motor from accidently moving when you exit the menus). Now select channel BBC 1 LONDON or TP 10.773H s/r 22000 Now loosen the dish a little to allow you to move it left or right. Move the dish slowly a bit at a time left and right until you get either a picture from BBC1 or the signal in your TP menu. When you get a perfect picture or strong signal then tighten the dish up. We now have our first satellite under USALS and can look for others. Set motor setting back to USALS and send it to another satellite ie 5 west. Allow dish to move to 5 west and when it stops fine tune the dish slightly until you get a picture or TP.When you get 5 west perfect then send dish back to 28.2 to see if signal is still ok. Remember you may need to fine tune the dish several times until you find the right setting for the arc. Take time and patience and you will get there . Please let us know if this has helped you a little or if you have any queries. Regards.

[ramjet]

the above would only be correct for london or anyone on the greenwich meridian , it would not be correct for say dublin or cork or stockholm for instance

hispasat is at 30 west and dublin is at 6.2w so hispasat is actually 30-6.2 west of dublin which is 23.8 degrees , so as true south is always set to the zero on the dial it would move 23.8 degrees west of zero to get to hispasat , not stop when it gets to 30 which is what you said above

usals uses your longitude and latitude , not your postcode , so it actually uses your gps position as shown on your satnav when you are at home

and when you switch to diseqc from usals the motor should not move at all , and you store that position into your motor which stores it according to your particular location, once all satellites have been stored you can use diseqc just as easily as usals

the point of using usals is to simplify the installation by setting your gps location into your receiver, sending the motor to a known satellite and then finding it by moving your motor and dish having already set the dish motor latitude and locking it

I would have thought an installer would have know the above details and its not as simple as you stated when you said the motor is sent to 30 on the dial for hispasat, it certainly doesnt on my new dark motor or on my old motek and stab motors , but it would have been correct if my longitude was 0.00w

a lot of installers in the uk make this mistake when they set a dish up because they set it on 0.00 instead of setting the 0 marker to true south

[Nutsandbolts]

Hi Ramjet. I must take issue with you on a number of points.
a) In this forum you keep telling people to use their postcode to find their latitude and longitude. Now you are saying it has nothing to do with the postcode.
b) On the TM2600 motors as far as i am aware when you send dish to 30 west the motor will stop at 30 west on the dial. Actually this is set in your USALS menu under SAT POSITION. If you change HISPASSAT to 25 west in SAT POSITION the motor will stop at 25 west. This is the reason why motors have a dial with numbers on so they know at what point to stop.
c) I have not said that my longitude is set at 00.0w but 00.1w so again you are incorrect.
d) I think you will find that true south refers to the way the dish is pointing - nothing to do with the motor. If you have a dish mounted on a wall looking at no signals having a motor is not going to get you any signals either. This is what installers mean when they tell you to mount your dish on a south facing wall.
e) It dont matter if you live in London, Dublin, Manchester etc the satellites will always be in the same positions. The ability to find the arc depends on the way you set up your dish angles,LNB skew etc. This is the reason why under USALS you need to find the first satellite correctly so that it will know which way to go for the other satellites.
Please take this comments as observations rather than criticism. Like i said i have never had any problems with the TM2600 motors and by the way i am not an installer but have learned from reading comments in various forums. One thing i have learned though is that everyone has a different way of doing things and think that they are always right.
Take care.

[pedro2000uk]

...
I would have thought an installer would have know the above details and its not as simple as you stated when you said the motor is sent to 30 on the dial for hispasat, it certainly doesnt on my new dark motor or on my old motek and stab motors , but it would have been correct if my longitude was 0.00w

a lot of installers in the uk make this mistake when they set a dish up because they set it on 0.00 instead of setting the 0 marker to true south

We've sorted a lot of poor motorised installs out with a collection of many of the same classic errors, I can't remember seeing that one but I'm sure you're right.

btw.. apart from the motor @ 0.0, the motor doesn't actually move to absolute satellite longitude markings on the motor dials even if the longitude was 0.0, the motor would move to roughly 33-34w on the motor dial for 30w in the UK- it will move less past the 30w marking the further away from the equator you are more the nearer to the equator.

That takes into account your latitude on the calculations plus that fact that the dish is installed on the surface of the Earth & the Earth is spherical, the only way the dial would match the positions of the satellites would be in the center of the Earth & aimed at 0.0, the dial is just a base reference .....

...so if you see that 30w is 3-4 degrees further including allowing for your longitude's offset... it's about right.

[ramjet]

Hi Ramjet. I must take issue with you on a number of points.
a) In this forum you keep telling people to use their postcode to find their latitude and longitude. Now you are saying it has nothing to do with the postcode.
b) On the TM2600 motors as far as i am aware when you send dish to 30 west the motor will stop at 30 west on the dial. Actually this is set in your USALS menu under SAT POSITION. If you change HISPASSAT to 25 west in SAT POSITION the motor will stop at 25 west. This is the reason why motors have a dial with numbers on so they know at what point to stop.
c) I have not said that my longitude is set at 00.0w but 00.1w so again you are incorrect.
d) I think you will find that true south refers to the way the dish is pointing - nothing to do with the motor. If you have a dish mounted on a wall looking at no signals having a motor is not going to get you any signals either. This is what installers mean when they tell you to mount your dish on a south facing wall.
e) It dont matter if you live in London, Dublin, Manchester etc the satellites will always be in the same positions. The ability to find the arc depends on the way you set up your dish angles,LNB skew etc. This is the reason why under USALS you need to find the first satellite correctly so that it will know which way to go for the other satellites.
Please take this comments as observations rather than criticism. Like i said i have never had any problems with the TM2600 motors and by the way i am not an installer but have learned from reading comments in various forums. One thing i have learned though is that everyone has a different way of doing things and think that they are always right.
Take care.

and I would have thought that you would have taken my points on board , clearly you havent

a) yes I do say people should use their postcode to find their gps position , but its the gps position that is crucial , not the postcode , and do not forget we are using the uk when we talk about postcode , many members live in other countries , so the point here is that the postcode allows you to find your longitude and latitude, and it is they that are important here, and none uk members would be better served by checking dishpointer or using a satnav or gps mobile phone instead

b) kak m8 , if you were in stockholm your zero pointer would point almost at astra at 19e and sky at astra 2 at 28 east would be 10 degrees east of you so the pointer would point at 10 east on the motor dial , and thor would point at about 18 west , with hispasat pointing at about 47 west , so your analogy is totally incorrect and not borne out by the facts, the pointer is not there to point at the sats but to show you how many degree you have moved from one reference to another reference

your analogy only works in or around the greenwich meridian , something you totally ignored in my previous answers

I suggest you try an install in liverpool or cork or stockholm instead of a cosy install in london or the south east , you might actually change your tune once you see it in action

c) I do not care what your longitude is , 0.1w , 0.1e , makes very little difference to me , I was using the absolute zero as being greenwich for the greenwich meridian , look it up if you dont know what that is ;)

d) true south is where the motor is at zero , already told you that , and its nothing to do with the dish , the pointer on the motor mount points at zero which is due south of you , for cork its actually pointing at the satellite at 8 west and for stockholm its pointing at 18 east , so somebody in cork would point the dish and motor at 8 west with the motor pointer on zero on the motor itself , and it would point at 22 degrees on the pointer when its on the 30 west hispasat position

e) usals takes your gps position and moves the motor to an offset position relative to your gps position , so gives an 8 degree offset if you are in cork , and an 18 degree offset if you are in stockholm , and that is why the system works under usals , when I started I had to calculate this manually and mark the motor accordingly and then setup using diseqc , maybe you should try this in order to learn the job properly ?

f) Please take this comments as observations rather than criticism. Like i said i have never had any problems with the TM2600 motors and by the way i am not an installer but have learned from reading comments in various forums. One thing i have learned though is that everyone has a different way of doing things and think that they are always right.
Take care

so my point is learn what you are talking about and do not mislead people with poor information or completely kak information

as I stated , your information and experience seems to be based on installations around london , so do not try to teach others who are a few degrees away from london until you have learned the basic rules , its too easy to assume what happens in london is what happens elsewhere , it isnt

and obviously the satellites never move position and I never said they did , but the motor owners positions vary and that is what you should have taken into account

so lets say I was in liverpool , I would be at 3 west for my due south , I would set the motor to zero and point it at true south (not magnetic south) and the satellite we know as thor at 1 west is actually 2 east of me , so my motor would point at 2 east when I send it to thor , and would point at 27 west when I send it to hispasat , thereby destroying your theories

suggest you check this out carefully before posting again , as your maths do not add up, and your analogy is flawed

time to learn the correct details , as posted by krazylegs in the sticky threads where one member was from stockholm so check those details too

http://www.digital-kaos.co.uk/forums/f11/how-install-motorised-dish-42881/

the details posted by pedro are also correct , and show my analogy of your gps position being crucial when checking the motor details on the pointer on its mounting , so my points are based on the simpler principles , but my motor is not pointing at the 30 degree mark when it is on hispasat , and not at the 28 east mark when on astra 2 - and my zero marking is nearer 4 west than 1 west - FACT

its nice to see that at least one actual installer (pedro) understands these facts , but as he is in cheshire his installs have to take those details into account

regards

[Nutsandbolts]

Hi. Its nice to know that in London we have motors that actually do what you tell them to do. I find it hard to believe that you only have one installer that agrees with you. Take care.

[Manic01]

Hi. Its nice to know that in London we have motors that actually do what you tell them to do. I find it hard to believe that you only have one installer that agrees with you. Take care.

That makes me laugh hehe.

[ramjet]

Hi. Its nice to know that in London we have motors that actually do what you tell them to do. I find it hard to believe that you only have one installer that agrees with you. Take care.

still a load of kak m8 , and its one more than you had too

your post suggests that you havent got a clue how to align a motor unless you are in london where its the easiest it can ever be

if you do what I have done and actually test a usals receiver on a usals motor (spiderbox 9000 on a motek sg2100 motor) you get the following results for 30 west hispasat using usals

liverpool , 3 east , hispasat is on 30w on the motor indicator

castlegregory at 10e in western ireland , hispasat on 10 west

moscow on 37.6e shows hispasat at 67w (which is why they have 70 or 80 on a motor)

warsaw at 21e shows hispasat at 54 west

norwich at 1.3e shows hispasat at 35 west

stockholm at 10e shows hispasat at 43 west

so where you get this crazy idea that hispasat always shows 30w on a motor mount is beyond me

perhaps in future you will actually read my posts and understand the reasons behind what I say instead of assuming london is at the centre of the universe and it dances to your tune

in the meantime I stand by my posts so far and was educating philbeardmore until you stuck your oar in

as for the number of installers , some havent had a say yet , and others have hit the thanks button

post a poll if you think your ideas on this are correct , but in the meantime test your theories my hooking your box to a spare motor and look at the motor indicator as you change your longitude to different locations (like I did, you do not require an attached dish to test the theory)

and try reading the sticky thread which details the correct info (by a moderator here), or is he wrong too ?

the only reason you londoners have the correct details is due to the fact that 100 to 200 years ago the uk hosted a competition to sort out longitude and latitude using regulated clocks , and greenwich was selected as the basis of the reference position (GMT) , had it been moscow things would be vastly different ;)

and this was for the sailing ships , not satellite , so its just a cooincidence that the rest of the world took their cue from greenwich , and was from where longitude and latitude came in the first place

maybe next time you will check your facts before posting ? I hope so

so Please take this comments as observations rather than criticism. Like i said i have never had any problems with the TM2600 motors and by the way i am not an installer but have learned from reading comments in various forums. One thing i have learned though is that everyone has a different way of doing things and think that they are always right.
Take care

I do not think I am right , I know I am right , a good point I think ?

[Philbeardmore]

Woahhh, thanks guys but I'm starting to feel a bit guilty here for starting something! :-)

The conflicting views has actually given me a better insight and understanding of the complexities around satellite tv.

On the info provided I've managed to load the channel list, and pick up BBC news on 28.2 Astra. I've got a good signal (around 80%) and quality is sitting around 95% but obviously the quality changes depending upon the channel on Astra.

Thing is when I try and view a channel on another sat the motor moves but I can't pick up any channels. I assume my alignment is out somewhere. Will have another look at it tomorrow as its dark outside now.

I've just realised that I need to apply the latest patch to the Spiderbox in order to allow the "gift" - this should affect my alignment will it. (I.e the receiver wont think my dish is in one position when it's actually in another)

Thanks again

[Nutsandbolts]

Hi. Hey dont feel guilty about people having different points of views this is what forums are for. If people want to give you a history lesson from 200 years ago which has nothing to do with installing a motor on a dish they are entitled to do that. All i know is that i am 100 percent happy with the way my motor was set up and working the way it should work. Good luck with your installation. Regards.

[Manic01]

@Nutsandbolts
Ramjet is correct mate, setting up the way you do is ok for london but not for elsewhere.

You stated this in TM section
http://www.digital-kaos.co.uk/forums/f75/help-sat-finder-256307/
27th March, 2012, 08:24 PM #11
Nutsandbolts
Senior Member
always be set as West and North ( for the northern hemisphere). The longitude should be West(W) and latitude should be North(N). For London it is 00.1W 51.5N. The W and N are used by the motor software to know which way is east and west for the satellites. Regards.

Replied to by DickB
Those that live in essex,suffolk,norfolk,kent etc are all east of the meridian so might disagree

[ramjet]

Woahhh, thanks guys but I'm starting to feel a bit guilty here for starting something! :-)

The conflicting views has actually given me a better insight and understanding of the complexities around satellite tv.

On the info provided I've managed to load the channel list, and pick up BBC news on 28.2 Astra. I've got a good signal (around 80%) and quality is sitting around 95% but obviously the quality changes depending upon the channel on Astra.

Thing is when I try and view a channel on another sat the motor moves but I can't pick up any channels. I assume my alignment is out somewhere. Will have another look at it tomorrow as its dark outside now.

I've just realised that I need to apply the latest patch to the Spiderbox in order to allow the "gift" - this should affect my alignment will it. (I.e the receiver wont think my dish is in one position when it's actually in another)

Thanks again

either save your channel list or if unchanged from the one I uploaded then reuse that one again after patching

do a factory reset BEFORE and AFTER patching as well , then reload the channel list and carry on

if you are getting one satellite like 28e, and yet no others (or few others) then your arc is incorrect and has happened to many people many times

just follow the instructions I gave you ensuring the motor mount is on the correct latitude and that your latitude and longitude has been put in correctly into your receiver so that the receiver has the correct offset inside its settings

if you are using astra 2 at 28.2e (not astra) as a reference , do not use bbc news as there are bbc channels on other satellites and may confuse you

try using vintage tv , or the vault , or bbc1 or itv1 as they are specific to astra 2 at 28.2e (or eurobird at 28.5e) and they are fta too, channels like the vault or vintage tv also have lower signals and so require a more precise alignment to work properly, as you need to use weaker signals to align a motor and the usual ones like bbc1, itv and ch4 or 5 are very strong in the uk so are not as precise

ideally you should be using 0.8w and looking for bbc world news on 11862H 28000 and the Music Channel on 11900H 28000 which are both fta channels on thor/intelsat at around 1 west and will be close to the zero marker on the motor , at the top of the arc and the dish will be almost vertical

dont worry about the war of words , there is always somebody throwing toys out of the pram when they are proved to be incorrect in what they are saying, but it really p*ss*s me off when incorrect information is put out on forums, especially when the mod krazylegs gave out the correct information 3 years ago in his sticky thread

only those wearing blinkers will not take heed of the correct details and then they seek to belittle the person who gave out the correct details, proving they were not interested in the truth, only trolling !

this is why so many installations go wrong, too many people think they are in london and ignore the facts causing bad installations when they are in lancashire or essex or sweden or ireland

where they get the idea that living in the northern hemisphere means using WEST and NORTH is incorrect too , you either use WEST or EAST as required
so for stockholm you would use 10 east, not west , but for liverpool you would use west , 3 west !

the point here is that the further away from the greenwich meridian you are, the more precise the install has to be as there is no room for error and those of us not living inside the M25 "bubble" have learned this the hard way and have proper installations because of the knowledge we gained, and then we try to help others like yourself do it properly and to avoid the misinformation put out by those who know *** all

the 200 year old history lesson has EVERYTHING to do with setting up a motor as it relates to how and why the longitude and latitude lines were agreed and set as reference parameters for the old sailing ships to navigate around the world, it is no less relevant to the 21st century where we use nuclear time clocks and the same longitude and latitude lines and reference points like greenwich to navigate using GPS on satnavs or gps locators, never mind using it to position satellites over the equator and to work out what you set your motor to when aligning it

its a shame that some people ignore education and those who do not learn from the past will find it bites them on the *** !

unless ignorance is bliss ?

[Nutsandbolts]

Hi. When people buy a motor they are not interested in history
lessons. They only want to put a motor on a dish and look for satellites. The motors you keep mentioning ie MOTEK or DARK motors have had loads of complaints from what i have read. I have never seen one complaint from TM2600 users. By the way i have changed my latitude settings to 45N, 38N 56N etc and guess what?. The motor still finds the satellites.I suggest you get yourself a TM2600 and stop giving history lessons which are a waste of time. Take care.

[Manic01]

You cant help yourself can you?
You are in denial.
Jaeger SG-2500 /Technomate TM-2600 /Moteck SG-2500
Same thing.

[ramjet]

Hi. When people buy a motor they are not interested in history
lessons. They only want to put a motor on a dish and look for satellites. The motors you keep mentioning ie MOTEK or DARK motors have had loads of complaints from what i have read. I have never seen one complaint from TM2600 users. By the way i have changed my latitude settings to 45N, 38N 56N etc and guess what?. The motor still finds the satellites.I suggest you get yourself a TM2600 and stop giving history lessons which are a waste of time. Take care.

you really havent a clue what you are talking about have you , as the above statement proves how ignorant you really are

your latitude on your motor is not controlled by your receiver as the receiver cannot control up or down movement , only lateral movement, so your experiments with latitude were a total waste of time as was you typing that info on here

if you wish to start to control up and down movement as well as lateral movement with your motor , get a motor that actually does it

when digging your own grave , the trick is to know when to stop digging as proved by the fact you had no idea a motek motor is a technomate motor

I suggest you stop giving out duff information as all you are doing is proving your own ignorance when it comes to this subject and it is you that is wasting everybodys time here with your intransigence and lies

leave it to those who actually understand what they are doing, and why it actually does it

[Shady]

intransigence




Thats a really good word :)

[ramjet]

on a side note, its a well known fact that the technomate motors (including the rebadged versions like my motek) will stutter and fail to operate smoothly when being controlled by a spiderbox if you are using the usals control method. however this does not happen if using diseqc mode

the darkmotors work flawlessly in both usals and in diseqc mode, and they have metal gears too , and those are the main reasons I changed from the motek motor, apart from the motor mount was rusting as its not galvanised like the motor body, so its now off the motor and being derusted and painted ready for installation elsewhere

anybody who has read a lot of posts would know about this problem when using tm2600 or similar motors with a spiderbox, as I am sure philbeardmore will find out when he tests his installation fully, and I have tested this theory when installing a tm2600 motor which was why I decided to swap to my darkmotor and this darkmotor works flawlessly too

so in his case he may be better to swap from the usals method to diseqc v1.2 after his motor is aligned correctly

from his efforts so far I do not think his longitude is 0.1w or anything near the greenwich meridian and this may account for his missing the arc so far

I stand by my statements in this thread, and I hope he realises where the correct information is coming from and acts accordingly, seeing as he hasnt got an easy time of it like those inside the m25 ! ;)

[pedro2000uk]

..... By the way i have changed my latitude settings to 45N, 38N 56N etc and guess what?. The motor still finds the satellites....

If you examine doing that very closely on a spectrum or decent meter you'll see that the satellites are then all out a %, the closer to the middle of the arc less so or even under USALS low resolution of 0.1 degree ..so no difference under USALS- even though the background USALS azimuth (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azimuth)calculations are a % out ... it will just round it up or down the same

..but the further out you go out from middle, the more out they will be ..a lot of meters won't show it that well, especially on large dishes on very strong satellites/ beams ... but you should see it on weaker beams/ satellites... just try 26e

[Nutsandbolts]

Hi Pedro. I find it hard to believe that you are an installer seeing that you were unable to give proper advice to fellow member nimbers. These poor person was looking for the west satellites and all you could tell him was to change the USALS setting by a couple of degrees etc. Why did you not tell him to move the motor tail up slightly to get the west satellites like i did?? Thanks to me he now has the west satellites. Let me explain to you and others a simple fact. If you get the east satellites and not the west you need to move the motor tail slightly up not adjust the USALS settings like you keep telling people. To motorize a dish is all about getting the height and angles set up rather than worrying about your USALS settings. Regards.

[mdt]

@ramjet is correct... i was helping someone with there motor(a tm2600) last sunday using usals on a vu+duo and(these are rough figures as i can remember) hispasat@30w was at about 33 degree,s W on the scale on the motor.. the lat long was(roughly) 53.6N/2.4W. IT ALL DEPENDS ON YOUR LOCATION!!!!, regards mdt

[Philbeardmore]

Cheers guys,

I wish I'd done my homework and gone for a different motor in the first place - oh we'll, you learn from your mistakes.

My plan of action now is:
Check and make sure the motor mount pole is perfectly level all round
Check that the dish is mounted with the centre of the motor arm
Check the lattitude is set correctly on the motor bracket
Set the motor back to zero and then do a reset on the motor.
Reset the receiver
Input the channel list
Set the lattitude/longitude on the receiver
move the motor to 0.8 Thor via the receiver
Select Bbc News channel and rotate the motor and dish until I pick up a signal
Once I do pick up a signal, try and select another satellite and see if I get anything. Fingers crossed

Does this sound like a good plan?

Btw - I used the motorised guide which is a sticky on this forum to carry out initial install and found it great - credit to the author.

[ramjet]

Cheers guys,

I wish I'd done my homework and gone for a different motor in the first place - oh we'll, you learn from your mistakes.

My plan of action now is:
Check and make sure the motor mount pole is perfectly level all round
Check that the dish is mounted with the centre of the motor arm
Check the lattitude is set correctly on the motor bracket
Set the motor back to zero and then do a reset on the motor.
Reset the receiver
Input the channel list
Set the lattitude/longitude on the receiver
move the motor to 0.8 Thor via the receiver
Select Bbc News channel and rotate the motor and dish until I pick up a signal
Once I do pick up a signal, try and select another satellite and see if I get anything. Fingers crossed

Does this sound like a good plan?

Btw - I used the motorised guide which is a sticky on this forum to carry out initial install and found it great - credit to the author.

sounds perfect to me , and is more or less what I did with my current and previous motors

not sure what your longitude actually is , but mine is a few degrees west so I tweaked mine today to improve 4 west, which was near my zero pointer on the darkmotor, and is close to my true south, then I checked thor , and 42e and 30w , then checked in between

I actually had to put the motor latitude to 1 degree out to improve 4w but the dish setting matched what was in the book that came with my darkmotor

my results were very similar to mdt`s in post #35

and with the dark motor I get a smooth and fast satellite change without the stuttering problem the technomates have with spiderboxes , so am I extremely happy with the result

however , you can get good results with the tm2600 , and it will run smoothly with your spiderbox if you change to diseqc after aligning it using usals

[pedro2000uk]

Hi Pedro. I find it hard to believe that you are an installer seeing that you were unable to give proper advice to fellow member nimbers. These poor person was looking for the west satellites and all you could tell him was to change the USALS setting by a couple of degrees etc. Why did you not tell him to move the motor tail up slightly to get the west satellites like i did?? Thanks to me he now has the west satellites. Let me explain to you and others a simple fact. If you get the east satellites and not the west you need to move the motor tail slightly up not adjust the USALS settings like you keep telling people. To motorize a dish is all about getting the height and angles set up rather than worrying about your USALS settings. Regards.


you're being silly now ..

... if someone tells you something you obviously don't know... you should see it as a positive - you learnt .. you gained .. not try a silly attempt to bring them down to your level -..

there are things you need to brush up on

[Philbeardmore]

For info my Latitude is 54.8N and my longitude is 1.38 W

[ramjet]

For info my Latitude is 54.8N and my longitude is 1.38 W

so thor should be quite close to your zero on the pointer , about 0.5 east , and is almost your true south

[Nutsandbolts]

Hi guys. Please tell me what i need to brush up on. it took me 30 seconds to tell a guy how to find the west satellites and you lot have spent many days telling him what to do without getting anywhere. keep up the good work i am very impressed.
Regards.

[ramjet]

Hi guys. Please tell me what i need to brush up on. it took me 30 seconds to tell a guy how to find the west satellites and you lot have spent many days telling him what to do without getting anywhere. keep up the good work i am very impressed.
Regards.


the only thing you have told on here is total sh*te m8

now all you do is troll posts and try to shoot the messengers

[mdt]

@nutsandbolts.. i think you should withdraw m8 before you embarrass yourself any further, regards mdt

[Nutsandbolts]

If i am telling total shite like you say why are people finding satellites with my help rather than the confusing rubbish that you give them. I think problem is you dont like people who are cleverer than you. Like i said keep up the good work. Take care.

[pedro2000uk]

is this the advice you have referred to that you gave


Hi nimbers. A couple of points for you to note.
a) if you need to change your longitude from east to west the way i do it on my TM5400 is i place the remote cursor on the E and press enter. This will change the E to W.
b) Regarding the west satellites, if you are getting the east satellites and not the west usually its because your dish is too low. Remember east satellites are low and west are high.If you watch the way the motor moves the dish you will see this in action. Also for some satellites like HELLASAT 39 east the dish needs to be tilted - again the motor will do this for you as it is calibrated to do so. If you are happy with east satellites then do the following:
c) Move the dish to 5 west. When motor stops check for signal via signal meter or channel like TMC. TP for this channel is 11.553V s/r 30000. If you dont get a signal or picture then try to move the motor tail up slightly by unscrewing the two motor bolts and pushing the tail up. Do not loosen the dish from the motor tail otherwise you will lose your east sats. Remember if your dish is too low or high
changing settings will not help, you need to change the dish height. Take care.

you do need to get or go back to the 'basics' & take people's advice in good faith & not just react against them... I was designing & installing motorised before motors- this is just the basics & they haven't changed.

[Shady]

@philbeardmore.. your questions are getting in the way of this handbag fight

[Philbeardmore]

Hi guys, just a quick update. I manages to get back up the ladders and check the mounting pole which was 100% plumb. The dish looked to be mounted correctly onto the motor, however I tweaked it slightly and I'm now picking up sats. I'm getting a good strength and good quality so I'm over the moon. Thanks everyone.

I do have one more question but it's spiderbox specific so not sure if I'm asking in the right forum but I'll give it a go.

I put the latest patch that I could find (2.32) on the box, but when I goto activate service plus it needs an id and password. I'm stumped. I'm assuming this isn't a gift patch???

Thanks again