Silca ID48 cloning solution

[nikifer]

Great news for Silca RW4 users.
Next year april 2016 will be released full ID48 cloning software and somekind of Megamos snoop hardware for RW4.
The price will be about 1000 euro for package .

Here is car list that can be cloned

Enjoy

GAGICA locksmith
Ferizaj

[DottoreBL]

not good :(

[simaservis1108]

Time to put up ad's for the sale of my cutting machines.They already have dust on them,maybe someone will put the to good use :)

[rapidlocksmiths]

the coverage list is impressive and will be a safer option than programming plus dealers wont be able to attempt to code them so they wont screw dash trying to code a key not on vas system is the plus side , the downside of course is vag keys will be entering the bargain basement in future .

i suspect future vag keys will move away from id48 to a new platform very soon

[indienick]

at least the cloner cannot offer remote functions, and most the cars on that list require diagnostic to program remote.

[adamgr]

Looks like no Vag precoded coverage too:)
Good good

[paul_12345]

Looks like no Vag precoded coverage too:)
Good good

it looks like this gets the full 96bits so can clone all id48.

Theres plently on the list thats 'precoded'

[rapidlocksmiths]

i can see alot of precoded coverage too

[indienick]

In USA, MVP can program 2010-2012 Jetta, but not 2013-2015

This list also shows Jetta can clone until 2012?

But on AVDI, 2010-2015 Jetta all programs exact same. I wonder why coverage is more difficult after 2012?

[paul_12345]

In USA, MVP can program 2010-2012 Jetta, but not 2013-2015

This list also shows Jetta can clone until 2012?

But on AVDI, 2010-2015 Jetta all programs exact same. I wonder why coverage is more difficult after 2012?

There maybe a issues with some integrated immo/remote keys maybe??

bit premature advertising this anyway when its not ready until april, hope cn900 beat them to it! although saying that cn900 have advertised id48 coming soon for years ;)

[vlado kljucar]

now everyone will be locksmith , bakery man,postman, web masters,butchers, lawyers......

[rapidlocksmiths]

this has been the case for many years already , so is nothing new , you only have to read the signatures on AD forum to see how many multi trades are now also auto locksmiths and general locksmiths . it will bring down rates on spare keys only , luckily less than 10% of the vag keys i do are spare keys , majority is still all keys lost , so an impact but not as major as at first sight .
the amount of beer boys trading with working clones is more of a threat to what we do than id48 cloning , we just evolve and deal with it as always .

[keyprogramming]

I think the price will keep the beer boys out (until the reliable clones arrive)
The RW4 Plus is ?1500 now, with the upgrade ?2K?
I'd imagine their budget will be sub ?500.

[rapidlocksmiths]

Keyline have released full id48 cloning from the 1st December , most distributors should have ample stock within first 10 days of decenmber , the coverage list can be found here http://www.keyline.i...ation_45581.pdf (http://www.keyline.it/files/tkm-xtreme/tkm-xtremekit_application_45581.pdf)

details can be found details can be found here http://www.keyline.it/eng/catalog/transponder-technology/software-updates/tkm-xtreme-kit.html

no deposits then wait months for release , they have released it first again .

ive had a beta test unit for a while and the test results from beta testers worldwide has been exemplary to date on id48 , id48 can and on id48 precoded models on application list.

For now keyline cloning is to TKM heads only and new horshoes have been released to cover the new cloning applications not covered before , but im told they are working also on an alternative solution to the TKM head as well which will follow once fully developed and tested .

good or bad , its here already and released already at all keyline distributors and price for those that already own an ultegra 884 or 884 mini will im told be on a launch special at around ?499 plus taxes , though im not 100% on the figures on these , but if this is the case then for new users and the price of the mini 884 its a cheap option for full id48 cloning for sure

[lunchb0x]

Keyline have released full id48 cloning from the 1st December , most distributors should have ample stock within first 10 days of decenmber , the coverage list can be found here http://www.keyline.i...ation_45581.pdf (http://www.keyline.it/files/tkm-xtreme/tkm-xtremekit_application_45581.pdf)

details can be found details can be found here http://www.keyline.it/eng/catalog/transponder-technology/software-updates/tkm-xtreme-kit.html

no deposits then wait months for release , they have released it first again .

ive had a beta test unit for a while and the test results from beta testers worldwide has been exemplary to date on id48 , id48 can and on id48 precoded models on application list.

For now keyline cloning is to TKM heads only and new horshoes have been released to cover the new cloning applications not covered before , but im told they are working also on an alternative solution to the TKM head as well which will follow once fully developed and tested .

good or bad , its here already and released already at all keyline distributors and price for those that already own an ultegra 884 or 884 mini will im told be on a launch special at around ?499 plus taxes , though im not 100% on the figures on these , but if this is the case then for new users and the price of the mini 884 its a cheap option for full id48 cloning for sure

So it clones with 12bytes of CS as well as 7?

How long has it been taking to clone? Hopefully not too quick :)

[paul_12345]

Theres already the chinese id48 that can change the id why dont they just use these and use tokens per use if they want to make more money per key rather than making different transponders.

These chinese id48 are the same size as the normal id48 so would be ideal, guess the chinese will release id48 cloning soon anyway using them

[rapidlocksmiths]

times range in tests so far between 5 minutes and 40 minutes , the quickest has been just under 5 mins the slowest has been 40 minutes in tests to date , ive not tested on a model yet with 12 bytes , ive asked the beta testers to see if any have thus far and await their resoponses

[rapidlocksmiths]

just heard from 2 of the beta testers and they have done 5 models between them that use 12 bytes of cs and worked like a charm they say making a perfect clone.

[rapidlocksmiths]

until a reliable stand alone calculator box is made by someone for them to copy , it will rely on the chinese having an adequate and reliable server to deal with demand , as an inadequate server that cant maintain a good connection for up to 40 minutes will be of little use .
im sure they will clone or release something , but until then il earn well from the keyline and silca options which will more than pay for the investment , then i have silca and keyline quality , back up , support and reliability earning just profit into the future , so a no brainer for me , il invest in both as have both main machines already so the add ons can be recouped and move to profit .

be interesting to see who releases a chip option first that fits in an oem or kd remote , which ever achieves this first will do the best i suspect in terms of sales , as despite the ability now to clone a tkm std key on a 2014 skoda superb , i cant imagine many skoda superb owners wanting a non remote key .

[paul_12345]

until a reliable stand alone calculator box is made by someone for them to copy , it will rely on the chinese having an adequate and reliable server to deal with demand , as an inadequate server that cant maintain a good connection for up to 40 minutes will be of little use .
im sure they will clone or release something , but until then il earn well from the keyline and silca options which will more than pay for the investment , then i have silca and keyline quality , back up , support and reliability earning just profit into the future , so a no brainer for me , il invest in both as have both main machines already so the add ons can be recouped and move to profit .

be interesting to see who releases a chip option first that fits in an oem or kd remote , which ever achieves this first will do the best i suspect in terms of sales , as despite the ability now to clone a tkm std key on a 2014 skoda superb , i cant imagine many skoda superb owners wanting a non remote key .

Now that someone has noted the unsecure key update there does not have to be any real calculation on one method.

All they need is a sniffing device for id48 to capture one valid challenge and response, then unlock the original key and brute force the key 2 bytes at a time. If Tango had a sniffer they could add this in a few hours tops.

[iamfooser]

Now that someone has noted the unsecure key update there does not have to be any real calculation on one method.

All they need is a sniffing device for id48 to capture one valid challenge and response, then unlock the original key and brute force the key 2 bytes at a time. If Tango had a sniffer they could add this in a few hours tops.
Are you trying to say that no one attempt to crack this for a decade? VAG started using them in early 2000 and it is almost 2016 now. For 15 years no one can manage to clone them. Now that someone can, you simply discredit the engineers and say it can be done in hours.

Silca is releasing this in months time, and tango can do it in hours. You must be kidding.

[H.Wessel]

Are you trying to say that no one attempt to crack this for a decade? VAG started using them in early 2000 and it is almost 2016 now. For 15 years no one can manage to clone them. Now that someone can, you simply discredit the engineers and say it can be done in hours.

Silca is releasing this in months time, and tango can do it in hours. You must be kidding.

As far as I know, no one engineers crack nothing, security papers of ID48 is public now, so I think that maybe yes, it can be maked in short time...

[paul_12345]

Are you trying to say that no one attempt to crack this for a decade? VAG started using them in early 2000 and it is almost 2016 now. For 15 years no one can manage to clone them. Now that someone can, you simply discredit the engineers and say it can be done in hours.

Silca is releasing this in months time, and tango can do it in hours. You must be kidding.

Tango already has the algo for id48 so it can verify a valid key already, it can also unlock the transponder in seconds - Hence why Tango can do it in hours as theres nothing much more needed in software, so yes they could do it in hours (software), they would also need a sniffer tool.

As stated the engineers have not cracked this at all but got the answers from the research paper.

Also any company that has had crypto engineers working on cracking id48 should be ashamed, I only recently looked a bit at crypto stuff and a unsecure key update is a major security flaw that any crypto analyst should spot straight away!

[rapidlocksmiths]

Im sure the paper has helped them all , but you cant take away the engineers achievement from both keyline and silca , they have achieved what no one else has yet , if it was that easy im sure all others would have done it long ago , though some are reported to have feared litigation from vag group if they did , but the fact is that keyline were first to crack and release id48 cloning 9 or 10 months ago and keyline are again 1st to release full id48 cloning on non vag and vag can and vag precoded 7 bit cs and 12 bit cs models too , if thats not an achievement then im unsure what is.

with keyline being first and silca a company once linked with keyline also about to release it says alot about italian innovation in this field especially when looking at cloners , keys , key cutting machines , they lead the game in these areas .

ive no doubt that now its out there most of the others will follow with their own solutions including the chinese , its inevitable and this too will join the race to the bottom , i dont doubt that tango engineers could have worked something out , but they didnt , keyline did and at the price they charge and the price of the mini they havnt been greedy either , their tkm heads are not everyones cup of tea , but with them working on another solution that will fit into oem remotes they at least have phase 1 finished and are moving to phase 2 , no one else has reached this point , so from me its credit where due.
i suspect some customers will be happy with a std key , others will want a remote but may be happy with tkm and a seperate kd b09 remote , others will only want an oem key , what im positive of is those shops currently turning these keys away will now profit from them and make a tidy sum before others catch up , which leads to another argument on how bad it is potentially to the mobile auto lockies , but its here and we deal with it.

il be glad when tango etc do catch up as always good to have options and as i have tango too il be glad to have it , just as im happy with my keyline and silca units . its a given that they will all have it at some point , but for now for a short while at least only keyline have it and lead the field , so well done to them and their engineers for their achievement.

[paul_12345]

Yes they did ok with the first id48 cloning, but still overlooked the obvious massive flaw.

With this new 'full' cloning they dont deserve much credit in my book only that they are the first to get it out.. but I suppose they had to be the first to release it so they could milk it as they know the Chinese will be close and much cheaper so it would have wiped out any profit if they didn't release it first.

And it was that easy, although the research team state a full 12 bytes takes <2.5 hours with a proxmark so whether better hardware like Tango could get the time down or whether they have had to implement the partial key-update attack desscribed in the research where a part of the key is brute forced to speed up the cryptanalysis method

[P&D]

Not sure about the discussion going on in this thread but every one is pushing this new system.....& it has been said milking it.........
because the other side of the world will release something soon maybe......maybe not.....just saw this which might add fuel to the fire....http://www.nwkeys.co.uk/Portal.aspx?page=43&cat=-1&prod=14134

Makes you think why.....get the ID48 clone FREE with a new RW4 Plus ??....save yourself ?400-?500 Push it to the max comes to mind

[rapidlocksmiths]

well from what i here TM100 has already stated they will have it soon and free for all customers , true or false its an interesting claim , ive no doubt that it will be available in china at some point , i wonder who will be first to crack a stand alone unit , interesting times ahead .

i saw the silca offer , its a good cheap offer for a full rw4 plus , worth buying a cheap cloner or a mini at ?199 to get ?1756 off of the rw4 plus with id48 , you would make money reselling the rw4 units on this deal unless limiting 1 per buyer .

[MrSporty]

Has anyone got access to a sniffer unit for any of the current ID48 kits .. be interestedto see what they are using.

[rapidlocksmiths]

only silca option uses a snoop or sniffer unit , they keyline unit uses the tkm head to sniff the data

[triak88]

saw, silca will have clasic transponder like GTI transponders?

[MrSporty]

There is no real need to have seperate transponders other than to make the user experience more fluid, as with the Keyline setup . The existing china ID48 glass tags with changeable ID's would work fine, it all depends if the company wants to lock you to a certain brand of TP/Keyhead.

[kemaster]

Just got an email - Silca announced newT6 size clonable transponder.

[keyprogramming]

Just got an email - Silca announced newT6 size clonable transponder.
Here's the official release.
Standard size chip is going to be extremely useful. Roll on springtime when its released.
http://www.silca.biz/en/products/key-replacement-business/automotive-technology/1342132/silca-id48.html

[paul_12345]

Here's the official release.
Standard size chip is going to be extremely useful. Roll on springtime when its released.
http://www.silca.biz/en/products/key-replacement-business/automotive-technology/1342132/silca-id48.html

Yes but how much? The chinese chips are a dollar or two, just need to wait for cn900 etc to release id48 cloning. Really dont see the point in spending more on another cloner and pay a stupid price for each transponder when most poeple have the tools to do the job quicker via obd.

Only good to reduce the risk programming obd on later VAG but waiting longer to clone and high transponder price I'd stick with obd until cheap china solution.

[2angel]

I think that china put clone vag id48, wait to see the real result
for sure id48 with 96bit is capable of cloning, for the rest waiting to see the result.

[diagprog7]

Vvdi2 will upgrade the clone id48 feature, but requires an additional adapter that is expected to sell in March. Can copy 96 bit password immo4. vag and you can use a small chip. maybe is great new!!!!!

[diagprog7]

uses a sniffer unit connect vvdi2 db15.
step:
1 ,insert orgi key to vvdi2 coil,
2,insert sniffer unit to car ,run car 8time.
3 insert orgi key to vvdi2 coil.
4 connect internet server ,wait
5,get 12 byte password.


from china xhorse.

[paul_12345]

uses a sniffer unit connect vvdi2 db15.
step:
1 ,insert orgi key to vvdi2 coil,
2,insert sniffer unit to car ,run car 8time.
3 insert orgi key to vvdi2 coil.
4 connect internet server ,wait
5,get 12 byte password.


from china xhorse.

Internet connection will let this down. Not very good for mobile use when you can not trust getting a good enough internet signal

[diagprog7]

Internet connection will let this down. Not very good for mobile use when you can not trust getting a good enough internet signal
This application, at present, must rely on the Internet, because there is a large number of data needs to be calculated and analyzed. We can connect to the Internet via mobile phones or computers. In China, the network speed is enough. The amount of data is very small, but he must rely on the operation of the server. With vvdi MB tools almost.

[lpf01]

Internet connection will let this down. Not very good for mobile use when you can not trust getting a good enough internet signal

I cannot imagine a situlation when you need to clone a transponder roadside.

If it is a fully lost key, you need to get everyhing from car, cannot clone, but when you have the data, why clone and not just precode match another tp to the car with the first one. Here peoples don't ask for go to their home to copy a car key, maybe there is different i don't know.

[paul_12345]

I cannot imagine a situlation when you need to clone a transponder roadside.

If it is a fully lost key, you need to get everyhing from car, cannot clone, but when you have the data, why clone and not just precode match another tp to the car with the first one. Here peoples don't ask for go to their home to copy a car key, maybe there is different i don't know.

Well by that logic there is no need for id48 at all, because you have to go to the car to sniff so why not just program?

If this can use the cheap id48 that can change id then there is no extra cost rather than programming, so on spare key jobs I'd seriously consider just cloning the transponder and programming the remote on newer VAG and remove the slight risk of killing the car.

[lpf01]

It's a bit different from open my workshop door and do 3 steps to customers car as doing a sphare key, than travelling 10-20 or sometimes 50-80 km to make a totally lost key i think.

Or did you travel that far do to a spare key? As i said i cannot imagine a situlation where you need to leave your workshop and travel to a place where bandwith is like cr*p to do an ID 48 cloning, i never said it's not a practical feature ( hell yes it is, i hate to do volvo keys for example).

Sorry my english is not the best, but i try to sleep on a dictionary next time, maybe... :)

[paul_12345]

It's a bit different from open my workshop door and do 3 steps to customers car as doing a sphare key, than travelling 10-20 or sometimes 50-80 km to make a totally lost key i think.

Or did you travel that far do to a spare key? As i said i cannot imagine a situlation where you need to leave your workshop and travel to a place where bandwith is like cr*p to do an ID 48 cloning, i never said it's not a practical feature ( hell yes it is, i hate to do volvo keys for example).

Sorry my english is not the best, but i try to sleep on a dictionary next time, maybe... :)

Maybe the phone signals are better everywhere in the world but in the uk theres plently of built up areas that have so poor signal you can't even open a webpage on your phone.

or at least you'd have to drive 100m to get some signal.

[kemaster]

Maybe the phone signals are better everywhere in the world but in the uk theres plently of built up areas that have so poor signal you can't even open a webpage on your phone.

or at least you'd have to drive 100m to get some signal.

That sounds scary

[autoTkey]

Just got notified Errebi is releasing a much cheaper than Keyline ID48 cloning solution. It will work on TPX8. JMA will also integrate cloning these chips in the EVO.
http://www.jma.es/Archivos/productos/TPX8cast_v03.pdf

[neverquiet]

Is it possible to get the full 7 bit CS from the decoded ID48 transponder?
And the same question for PCF7936 transponder for VW Touareg! Is it possible to get the full 7bit CS from the decoded transponder?
Has anyone tested?

[sunlocksmith]

time to star find something else to do all this company want to sell sell they tool 4000.00 zedfull no way jose im no buy more tool is a good machine but too expensive dont forget 1800,00 a year for support and unlimited tokend