CAT bad flash. ECM not communicating.

[joeseph666]

Okay DK'ers,

A friend was trying to flash a CAT. It never co-operated. Winflash stopped usually at 9%. Once it made it to 31% before getting lost. So after trying a bunch of times, it finally stopped responding. The adapter, DPA4 Plus, usually has a bright red led when connected to j1708 connector. Now it is only a dim red.

The voltage on the j1708 connector is still there... 12+, and 4.5+. But the DPA4 knows something is wrong because it only lights up softly. Is there a bench cable hookup we can make to get it to communicate? Is there any point to take ecm apart?
We have it off the truck.

[Far_Call]

what is the ECM part number and whats the Engine serial ?

[dieselequipos]

Okay DK'ers,

A friend was trying to flash a CAT. It never co-operated. Winflash stopped usually at 9%. Once it made it to 31% before getting lost. So after trying a bunch of times, it finally stopped responding. The adapter, DPA4 Plus, usually has a bright red led when connected to j1708 connector. Now it is only a dim red.

The voltage on the j1708 connector is still there... 12+, and 4.5+. But the DPA4 knows something is wrong because it only lights up softly. Is there a bench cable hookup we can make to get it to communicate? Is there any point to take ecm apart?
We have it off the truck.

Joseph is possible you upload bad flash

send to me a engine serial number for correct flash ..

[joeseph666]

Ok, I pm'ed you. But what we need to know guys... is there any way to make this ecm work again? We had a battery charger hooked to the truck when flashing. It was not taking alot of amps... 8 or so if I recall correctly.

[Far_Call]

Cant help u unless you forward the info I asked for!!!
Some ECM's will take more than one protocol so unless you tell me what ECM u have i cant help.

[joeseph666]

well now that this one is solved, I'll fill in the details to close this one right. While trying to flash the truck, with the ecm using the truck's battery power and a 40amp battery charger, the flashes just kept on failing. Eventually, the interface had problems with getting a solid connection... I saw it as a dim red led power light. I mistook this for a dead ecm.

This truck had a fuse for the diagnostic connector, which turned out to be heavily oxidated, and once that was cleaned up the interface got a good connection. Ok... now we were back to trying to flash this ecm.

After some more failures, we grabbed a few deep cycle batteries and hooked them up to the truck instead of the batteries on the truck, along with the same 40 amp battery charger. It took a few more tries, using ET 2009B now instead of ET 2007 and it finally made it to 100%.

In hindsight... if we had access to a CAT bypass harness, we would have eliminated the truck's poor wiring. That can be found here: MAWK INDUSTRIES: CAT for $400 with connectors.

We still haven't figured out why the ecm and interface functioned ok at the start, though with the same fuse in... later on... looked dead. Yes, we had backed up the ecm with ECM Replacement function. It should have been hard to program _from__the__begining_ with a fuse that made a bad connection due to it's oxidation.

Oh well..., lesson learned.

One question I have at this point is, does the bypass harness speed up the flash process?
I'll find out soon enough as I won't do this without one.

[Far_Call]

No it wont it will simply eliminate any outher electrical faults.
I prefere to flash direct to ECM. 12 Volts 5 amp is all u need.

[joeseph666]

Far_Call,

Same speed huh. Okay thanks. Wouldn't happen to know where I can get some instructions on making one of those CAT harnesses would you? I'd probably rather buy them at Mawk... but those cummins... it looks like there are about 4 to get. About 2k, just for cummins. Sheesh.

[Louie]

Depending on what is hooked up to the datalink wires on the OEM side of truck will depend on the speed of the flash. Example all my trucks have GPS tracking devices that hook up through the orginal OEM dia connector, then a pigtail harness coming from the GPS unit to the connector in the dash. If you flash with a bypass harness it cuts off 20min. As mentioned before it just depends on the application. Pm 70 pin or 40 pin ecm and I will tell you how to make your own bypass harness. As stated previously the you only need a 5amp circuit to power and flash ecm tho, so wiring was the problem.

[rp1210a]

"We still haven't figured out why the ecm and interface functioned ok at the start, though with the same fuse in... later on... looked dead. Yes, we had backed up the ecm with ECM Replacement function. It should have been hard to program _from__the__begining_ with a fuse that made a bad connection due to it's oxidation. "

An oxidized connection creates resistance. With no current going through it the oxidized connection pretty much stays the same. once you start pushing current through it (connected dpa4) the connection will start to heat up and change. Thats probably why it started off ok and got worse.

[joeseph666]

"An oxidized connection creates resistance. With no current going through it the oxidized connection pretty much stays the same. once you start pushing current through it (connected dpa4) the connection will start to heat up and change. Thats probably why it started off ok and got worse."

Yeah... that makes sense. So does getting a few boxes of new fuses, all different types, so I can replace them first! But then that would still leaves the questionable batteries on the truck, and then the various current loads that the truck puts on whatever power is provided, causing some degree of fluctuation to occur. So I think bypassing the truck electric system is a smart thing to do. Wish I had thought of this before I got the truck from hell.

[Louie]

oem connector Black dia Grey dia
batt pos= 53,52,48---------loc=B loc=A
batt neg= 63,65,67---------loc=A loc=B
blank loc=J Not App
blank loc=H Not App
Pin=8---------------------- loc=F Blank
Pin=9---------------------- loc=G Same
Pin=42----------------- loc=E Same
Pin=34--------------------- loc=D Blank
Pin=50--------------------- loc=C Blank

[Louie]

There is your diagram for making your very own bypass harness everyone!

[joeseph666]

oem connector ----------Black dia ----------Grey dia
batt pos= 53,52,48------loc=B ----------loc=A
batt neg= 63,65,67------loc=A ----------loc=B
------------------------------ blank loc=J Not App
------------------------------ blank loc=H Not App
Pin=8---------------------- loc=F ----------Blank
Pin=9---------------------- loc=G ----------Same
Pin=42--------------------- loc=E ----------Same
Pin=34--------------------- loc=D ----------Blank
Pin=50--------------------- loc=C ----------Blank

Cool... really awesome Louie.
Question. Maybe I am tired, but it looks like the diagram is saying I connect Oem pin 9 to the G location, for both the black diagnostic connector, and the grey diagnostic connector.

Problem... is... the grey, well it only has A through F.
Are you trying to see if I was paying attention?
Here's a pic.
http://www.obd2allinone.com/uploads/6pindeutsch-a.jpg

This looks like a decent price for one.
http://www.obd2allinone.co/sc/detail...em=6pindeutsch

Here's the truck connector side
OBD Diagnostics, Inc. - J1708 Deutsch Vehicle Connector, 6-position

[Far_Call]

Pinouts vary depending on 6 Pin plug or 9 pin with key or 9 pin without key.
You need 3 different pinouts on the plug along with varying pinouts on the ECM depending on ATA or CDL or both. then 70 Pin or 40 pin.
In your case i guess you working with 70 pin and a Truck plug which could be either 6 pin Grey or 9 pin with key Black.
ATA
Baterry Pos is B on Black 9 pin with key
Battery Pos is A on Grey 9 pin without key
Very easy to screw it up.