My toys

[PocketHero]

Hello guys!

We are running a small locksmith shop, and it makes me allways a lot of thinking about getting something or not, thats why I wrote this post.
I will try to tell what kind of key programmers (and other hardware) I have, and what they are good for.
I don't think that it will be better than others wrote about, but I have some experience using 'em
Sorry for my bad English, but I never learned this language, just (mis)using...

Key programmers:
- CK100 (V99.99)
-SKP900 (V5.0) Updated
- SBB2 (V2017)
- FVDI
- AVDI
- Tango
- SuperVAG
- Lonsdor K518ISE + SK-LT (Newest available) Updated
- Super VAG K-CAN 2
(and lots of cheap tools like Op-Com, 4in1 (Ford, Mazda, Renault, Nissan), VAGcom etc. They were too cheap to not to buy, but I don't use them.)

Eprommers:
- XProg-M 5.0 (chinese version)
- Orange5
- VVDI Prog 4.6.7 Updated
- Rosfar 3000 v7.8s
- TL866A
- AK90+ 3.19 Updated

Key cloners:
- ZedBull (Chinese version)
- Handy Baby + JMD key Updated
- RW4 Plus + M-box

Remote programmer:
- KD900

If theres any kind of questions, I'll try to answer as far I can.

Let's see the details:
- CK100:
A must have. Ideal to use it with SKP900. Cheap enough to have one, and sometimes it does wonders. Nice and easy to use, has 1032 tokens when you get it. Cheap token refill, and charges in 50% no tokens. I've a pdf on my phone with the compatibility list, so I can allways check if it can do the car, or not. Sometimes it does the newest cars too, for example a 2016 Ford Flex with smart keys. I had to buy an old Daewoo converter to it, but that's all. Has some limited pin-code tools, but don't wait for wonders. There are no update functions, but who cares for this money
You can get it from $70 with free shiping

- SKP900:
Good tool. Ideal to use it with CK100. The 1st one, what come with special adaptors for Hyundai, Kia and Honda. Does remote programing too, what can come handy often. With compatibility list on my phone, I can always know when it is good for the wehicle. It is rumored, that there won't come out more updates after 5.0, but we will see. If you have to deal with expensive cars (Jags for example) it can do wonders when updated properly. It has a free token system, but you need from time-2-time to refill it via internet - thats the most irritating point of the tool. You can update it via PC program - it is very slow, but it is worth to wait. Better pin tool than the CK, but nothing extraordinary. You can get it from $320 with free shiping
Update: It seems to be dead now - http://www.digital-kaos.co.uk/forums/showthread.php/648751-SKP900-Server-Down-Dead-no-more-Tokens
I think I don't have to change my mind after this sad news, because we lost only the updates and the token system, this toy stays usable for 2-5 years - depends on the cars age what you have to deal. Its price will be lowered in a half year, or you can get it without tokens on ebay almost for free

- SBB2:
A must have. I got it for last x-mas from me It is not so easy to use for the first look, but it has oddometer-correction tool, and can use .bin files or read directly from an eprommer. Has the same connector-collection as the SKP, is meant to be the next generation. It is said that it has all the function of the CK100, but I've found lots of diferences. Another advance is that it can read and delete trouble codes (DTCS), and clear oil change periods. This didn't work on a 2010 Kangoo II. It can be updated via internet, never tried, but it is said to be working. Better pin tool than the CK, but nothing extraordinary. Cheap enough for its knowledge, you can get it for $140 with free shiping.

- FVDI:
Cheap solution for the poors. It is the chinese clone of Abrites, with limited abilities. If you want to buy it, then try to get an older one, because the new ones are the clones of a clone. I don't want to waste time on detailed description, it can help a lot or freezee without any marks or destroy the connected car's parts - but it is cheaper than cheap, you can get it from $100 with free shiping.

- AVDI:
Professional tool for professionals (only). The best thing what you can have for programming and so on - for a lots of money. If you are a professional, you can't do your work without it: does a lots of cars via OBDII, what other tools can't (Benzs, Jag XK, various models of VAG group, aso). A class of its own. The prices are high enough to wait out the promotions (x-mas, aso). For the beginning buy only that module, what you mostly need, and buy the other modules when you can't avoid it. At the moment the Benz module is the best on the market what you can buy. Full package costs more, than $30.000, yearly subscription €200.

- Tango:
Another must have. It is modular like AVDI or TMProII, with limited free functionality for each manufacturers. The whole BMW package is free, so you have to get it if you have to deal with Beemers. To be honest it has lots of weak points, but the documentation what is included makes it worth to pay for: pictures of the devices what you have to look for, sometimes with location and unmount pics; list of the transponders what you can use to the chosen task; the name of the chip what you have to deal with. Packages are from 50€, you get the activation code in e-mail very fast, but can depend on your dealer. So much from the good side, let's see the weak points: It comes often, that you can't open the .bin files for their name, just have to find out where the program accepts it. For example: Yaris as Corolla, Insignia as Camaro, Cordoba as Polo, Picanto as C'eed, aso. It gives some well-known problems: can't do anything with the RB8 controllers, aso. It is a bit uncommon, that it wants to be updated allways, but who cares, it goes fast enough via smart phone too.
However: you have to buy this to be able to do your work, so take a deep breath, and pay: 1200€ for the basic sw+hw.

- SuperVAG:
Czeh curse upon us. 1000€ without oddometer correction, only for the Volkswagen group. This sounds fine, but they promise 1 year free update - even in September - what lasts only till January. In many cases the program says, that the key programing is blocked, try again later - but no words about how long to wait. The pin tool works rhapsodic: some times great, some times clean time wasting. Another weak point is the RB4/8.
The manufacturer said that the instrument cluster module is a good solution without soldering. My question is only "what is it good for - absolutly nothing"... The module says what to do, and when you follow the instructions, then it ends with an error message. You can try it many times, it won't deliver the needed result, as long you follow the popups. When (after several tries) you try to change, and press "no" instead "yes", then the things begin to change, and you could get the needed result. You could. Tried this module 3 diferent cars, then did the same work with soldering: the result shows that it is much more faster when you do it on the oldschool way.
Another joke is the yearly €160 for updates. Better spend this money on Abrites, it is much more worth of it.

- Lonsdor:
I can't really say if it is worth of its price, or not. I think I got a broken OBD-cable with the tablet, thats why it sometimes works, some times stops with connection error. Have to deal it with the seller, but thats another story. The tool is easy to use, has a lots of functions, in many places with screenshots how it should work. Not a cheap toy ($1400 with the Toyota pack), but I think it could be a good tool for the daily use (when you already bought it). Needs internet connection (at least once a week to check for updates) for some actions.
To be honest I've spent a lot of times to test it for DK, and I think it promises a lot, but now it is too weak in knowledge for this money. But if you already have it, you can hope that they will work on updates harder as a rock.
Update: It seems to be working now (at least with smart key cars). The making of a smart key for a '14 Dodge Charger was fast & easy: the only trick was that I had to chose Journey from the wehicle list. Pin reading and programing was done in 2 mins.
'13 Jaguar XJ: smart key programing in 2 mins
'14 Jaguar XK: chanceless (only Abritas knows this car today)
'13 Megane III Ph2: no pin reading, asks for pin to be able to do programming.
'11 Clio III Ph2 Grand Tour: Nothing. No communication.
2 pcs Astra H: No pin; 4 pcs Astra G: No pin; and a Corsa C: no pin.
'17 Mustang Shelby GT350: It was harder to get out the rubber pad from the cup holder, than the programing itself. Smart key added in 1 min.
'04 Clio II Ph2 30 sec without pin
'10 Megane III Ph1 RS under one minute with hands free cards
'08 Dodge RAM 1500: it toke 5 mins to catch that it has to be programed as it were younger than 2012. With that setting under a minute with pin extraction.
'07 E60 Beemer: The customer had a chinese folding key with 315 MHz and he paid for just the trying - we told him that it won't work - the only thing was that we had to re-activate the original keys. I think it can be done when you use the factory diamond 868 MHz keys.
'13 Dodge Charger smart key OK
'15 Ford Edge remote key OK, under 2 mins.
'04 & '06 Megane II: under a minute, normal cards
'15 Dodge Challenger: under 2 mins OK
Won't work with the Transit Connect variants (small furgons), neither Custom, Passenger, Tourneo. Tried only 5 of 'em from 2006 to a 2016 Eco Flex - no communication, or connection lost after reading the VIN. You can try it as Focus and Fiesta too - the result will be the same. I've made the programming mostly with the SKP900.
'15 Chrysler Town & Country under 30 secs with pin extraction
'11 Ford Transit (Normal big one) under 2 mins with AKL solution
Strange, but true: If you chose AKL @ Transit, then you can program only one key too, the difference is that the remote controller will be disabled, and the immo LED won't switch off, but you can start the car. Tested @ my mates transit, worked fine with only one key fine for 3 days, then was the second key added, because he hated to open the backdoor with two turns to open direction on the driver's door. When I added the second key, the remote began to work again (was added before teaching key).

I think it is a good tool if you have to deal with smart keys - if pin is needed and the Lonsdor can't deliver it I don't try again when i get the codes.

- Super VAG K-CAN 2:
Just to solve the RB4 / RB8 problem by Audis. Cheap enough to save you in such situatinos. I got it 2 weeks ago, but had no possibility to try it. With free shiping only 70 bucks.

I don't know how others think about that situation when you can't read out the content of a chip, but I swear to myself that it won't happen again. That's why I have so much eprommers, just to avoid such situations.

- XProg-M:
Good tool, but not necessary to have (or get a chinese one). It was the first one what I had, but you can find where it leaks sooner as you could think. It was and is a very good eprommer. Very good if you have to deal with Motorolas, but not so universal than the O5, or the VVDI Prog. If you buy the original one, it can be expansive: €2000 for the full set with all the sw authorization and connectors, but you can get the chinese clone of v5.5 from $50.
Warning: The cheap version can cause troubles, because it is built from cheapest parts. Sometimes 0.01 V difference can cause expensive troubles

- Orange5:
A must have. You can't avoid to get it if you want to do the car work seriously. Good for EEPROMs, MCUs, has a good Immo-content. This immo-part can be very helpful: in many cases you have only to solder some vires to the PCB, and you can read/write the needed content. Contains tons of pictures of immo-boxes, ECUs, and other PCBs; chip pinouts, and lots of useful informations. The basic kit costs only €350, I suggest to pay a bit more, and buy all the needed connectors with the basic kit: SOIC8 DIP8, SOIC8 14 soldering, SSOP8, Lead whith clips POMONA SOIC8 & DIP8, PQFP52 PQFP80, TMS374, 912 908 and 705E6 in-circuit leads, HC11ES and 05B6 WDT VW chip connectors (be getle with 'em, otherwise you have to buy a new one after 5-10 uses), ST62xx, 908AS60/AZ60 QFP64, all Motorola connectors. You will see how often do you use this connectors, and you can re-order the frequently needed ones.

- VVDI Prog:
The best 2nd eprommer what you can get (for moderate price). Mostly used for Beemer and Benz in our shop. Not too expensive, but easy 2 use. I bought it when we had difficulties with a Beemer and the problem was solved in no time. Has good pictures for in-circuit-use, and needs less connectors as the O5 for the daily use. A bit uncommon look, but you can find everything if you look with open eyes Free updates and compatibility with all other X-Horse product. With free shiping costs $400, thanks to its origin no clones are available.
Update: It f**kked away a '08 W169 A class's flash. Toke a lot of time to repair it. My dealer said that it can happen often @ Benzs. Maybe the only way to avoid data loss is to push the "Read ID" button first. If the identification is ok, then you have your chance (tested on a '11 W245 B class). Other mistake was made by a CAS4 reading of this eprommer. Can't tell ya more about this just readed about it.

- Rosfar
To be honest never used this tool. I'm pretty sure, that it has its potential, but better don't spend money on this except you get it used around 50-100 bucks. Has no support, the original company went bankrupt, and the new owner does nothing, just sells the existing stuff for €1000. It was a good tool 10 years ago - but now it is overaged. I can't really tell why I bought it (because it was cheap and supports Beemer), but God only knows when it can come handy. Works with EWS1-4, CAS1-2.

- TL866A
Cheap chinese toy, has 24 connectors. Bought it when I couldn't find a TTL connector to the exsisting ones, and my dealer was on holiday. I got it within a week, seems to be correct enough. Since its arrival I used to it only once to test it. The binaries were the same readed by TL & O5, so I put it back to its box, and not used anymore. As far I see it is a perfect hobby tool, costs only $40 with free shiping. When compared with X-Prog I would prefer the other eprommer, or buy both of 'em (only the cheap version!).

- AK90
Too cheap to not to have it if you have to deal with old BMWs. Excellent EWS tool, makes everyone happy: the customer can get a cheap remote key, and you can make fast profit. Has plug-on-chip connectors, what are doing its work perfectly if you remove the protecting resin from the chip pins. Does all EWS protocols, but be cautious it can delete the 2D47J content.
You can get it from $25 with free shiping.
Update: Since a half year or so it gives the next generation of the tool called 'AK91(+)' around $400. Just don't spend your money on this, a lots of devices know the EWS 4.4 programing for a better price
Another extension is the X-Prog, R270 and AK90 adapter for EWS 4.3 & 4.4. Needs no soldering, no on-chip-reading, you have only to fasten the PCB in it, and you can read and write the datas. The price is approx $35 with free shiping - I think it is worth to get it for hobbist and pros too

Key cloning is one of the most important part of our job. My policy is "better cloned as programed", because a cloned chip works for sure; while you can have lots of unexpected errors when you try to add a new key.

- ZedBull
Good tool, but overaged. I have the cheap Chinese version, and have downloaded the EFfI sw to be able to use all functions of it. Cheapest way to clone, but has its own limits, whats are easy to reach with ID46 and 48 chips. Nothing to risk with its $20 price (mostly with free shiping), but don't take it too serious

- Handy Baby
A must have! At the moment it is the best handheld cloner, what you can get. With the JMD key expansion it can save you with ease when you have to deal with VWs - even in AKL situations. It is not a wonder weapon, in practice it needs time for calculations (some times 45 mins), but in the meantime you can cut the key, aso. Never tried with G-chips, so I can just tell ya that it is said to be working. Has built-in batteries, and you can always charge it from your car - ideal tool to take with you. The special transponders are cheap enough to save you a lot of money compared to the RW4, and the main unit costs only $350, the JMD Key box around $250, and the G-chip authorization (if not included) $80, always with free shiping.
Update: They stopd selling the JMDD, JMD6, JMD8 chips, instead of 'em you can buy Blue or Red King Chips. The blue one is for everything except ID48 for the usual price, the red is for ID48 much expesiver.
Some news in the following threads:
http://www.digital-kaos.co.uk/forums...clone-mazda-ac
http://www.digital-kaos.co.uk/forums...r-success-rate

- RW4 Plus
For professionals (only). It is made by Silca, that means it is expensive. I bought it together with the M-Box (in a special promotion with 10 ID48 and 40 GTI chips), when my Handy Baby couldn't clone the key of a TT. It works with special devices called "snoop"s, one for ID46 and another (M-Snoop) for ID48. It needs internet connection for calculating a 48 transponder, can take 20 mins or more for the whole procedure. Works only with the expensive Silca transponder chips, so I try to avoid its usage if possible to save profit. Good point, that you can power it from your car or from AC, but its size is too big to take it always with you. Its price was (in special promotion) €2100, ask your locale dealer about promotions - otherwise it can be €3000 or more with ease.

In our profession you can't overcome the remote key fobs, so there comes the best solution what I could find for this...

- KD900
Another must have. It can save your a$$ in the most important moments, so don't hesitate - innovate! With PC sw for that cars what are more difficult as the others it works fine, can save you a lots of money 'coz its remotes are cheaper than the originals, and are easy to code 'em for almost every car. Usually I don't have anything else for the VAG group, in rare cases I replace the KEYDI head with original Audi (for the logo) and the customer has a cheap Audi remote, we have our profit. This tool is good for everybody: the cheapest for own use, the 900 for pros.
You can buy the KD stuffz from $25 (Phone version), the 900 costs $230 with free shiping. Remotes are available from $6.5/pcs

So much for now ... In the next post I will introduce some other tools what I met, keep on checking

[PocketHero]

The Legend continues, with another toys this time with tried, but never owned tools - except some of 'em

The list:

- VPC100
- Mini CN900
- Xhorse Remote Key Programmer
- VAGcom
- OPcom
- 4 in 1 (Renault, Nissan, Mazda & Ford programmer)
- MVP Pro
- Tango Clone
Update:
- CAS 2-3 & 4 tester
- MDP Programmer: XEP100
- SKP1000
- TMPro2

So much for now, maybe later I will add some more.

- VPC100
A real joke. They say that this is a pin code calculator - I say it is a dust collector. It works with tokens, for the beginning you get 100 (I got 300, another 200 net-tokens too, to be able to count pins on the vpc website). I don't know why, but usually it counts more than one token for the worst results too. For example: Nissan Almera 2004. Date code is 11924A; encrypted pin is E0D4 and the NATS came from Mexico. Pin is 8568. The VPC website delivers the same result for 4 web-tokens (8 if you don't register a machine), but you need a bit experience what to enter and where and how... BUT: the device itself delivers the same result for 4 tokens - staying at this example. We met such Almeras, where the net and the device version gave out wrong results. It does not know the Infinmity keycode (can be counted from VIN), charges you for 4 token @ Hyundai/Kia pin code (CK100 gives it for free) and so on. If you are looking around you can find @ the download section the programs for free what can avoid the usage of this tool.
Nowadays it costs ~$25 with 100 tokens.

- Mini CN900
Meant to beat out the Handy Baby from the market, but as far I see without success. This one is the handheld version of the CN900, as the developers said with all of its abilities. Ok, this info comes from my dealer: the mini knows only 80% of the HB's work tested on real cars. If you have handy baby you don't need the cn. Price is around $150 with free shiping.

- Xhorse Remote Key Programmer
Never owned, gives better ones. This is the alternative when you don't want to have lots of devices: a mini CN900 built in one box with a KD900 clone. Some of the owners talks about this tool as it were the Holy Grail, others try to sell it fast after its arrival. The fact is that the Handy Baby is more better than the mini CN, and the KD is good and stabile. I can imagine only one situation where it can be useful: if you have a lots of original factory remotes without cars, because this toy has a renewing pad kit for original remotes. The cloner works only with its own transponders, around $3.5 a piece, what equals the Handy Baby chip prices (except the blue/king chips); the remotes are also in the same price (around $10). It costs $220 with free shiping, another $320 for the remote renew kit, or together for $499.

- VAGcom
Uncomfortable. I bought it coz it was to cheap enough to buy it, but is too difficult to use. A simple Seat remote re-teaching can be done in three different places - I better prefer the SKP900 for this. Some are swearing, that this is a good tool, but to be honest it is too uncomfortable for me. Yo can get it for $6 with free shiping, so you don't risk anything when you get it.

- OPcom for Opel/Vauxhal
Another too cheap tool - but I didn't succeed to install it. It is said to be able to read pins trough OBD from Astra G or younger, but I couldn't do anything with it. You can get it from China from $12 with free shiping

- 4 in 1
Cheap toy for everyone. Bought it because it can be used for Renault, Nissan, Mazda and Ford. I couldn't use it because I don't like to run around with a laptop, when other tools can solve my problem too. The Nissan part couldn't read out pin from a NATS2 device, then the Renault part wasn't able to do programing on a Thalia - so I drop it out from my car. I think it is a more-than-nothing tool for hobbists, costs only $30 with free shiping.

- MVP Pro
The big question. Another Silca tool, that means it is damn expensive. My pal bought it, so he can lend it to me when I need it ;D The most important thing is that it works with tokens. Very expensive tokens if you ask me, because usually I pay 10€ for a token. I know it is cheaper when we buy 100 or more, but I think it is near to robery.
The tool itself is modular, you can buy only the needed parts, but I think if you give money for this, then get the fully featured version. I use it as 'the last possibility' when nothing else works. It worked only once when I couldn't teach an Alfa 147 factory remote key in AKL situation. All other tries were just a shoot in the dark, but in that cases the cars were damaged.
The price of the full version is around $3700 or 2000 quids + VAT depends on your contry and dealer.
You can get a chinese clone of this device, costs around $150 with free shiping - can't tell ya anything about it, wasn't drunk enough to order it ;D

- Tango Chinese clone
God! Have mercy! A real crap. Mostly you can't trust it, but has all sw packets what the original can offer. The only positive thing what I can tell ya is the built-in full documentation what the original had. Ok, it is not so tragic as it seems for the first look, but it makes often mistakes. I think €200 is too much for the documentation only when the hw itself is worthless, and sooner or later you have to buy the original one.

- CAS testers
Good toys when needed. I bought 'em together with my X6 on IKS '17 from a Polish company. The price was €100 for each (CAS2-3, CAS4). They are a bit expensive, but can help you out if you get only the CAS module to make keys from it. With the use of 'em you can be absolutly sure that your key works fine - avoids a lots of troubles when the car is defected.

- XEP100 Prog
Another tool for pros only. In full version it costs €4800 what is a lot of money for a single eprommer. Ok, that's the full version with tablet and everything, but... You have support with it. I mean real one. Not like Simon Touch's unreachable one, but a real one. "On demand program flashes database allow you to fix ECUs damaged by other programming interfaces." Another good point is "No need to heat the microprocessor within any temperature range". My dealer ordered one, I will see when I can test it, and how far are the producers promises true. Until then I can only tell ya that I haven't met bad reputation about this tool.

- SKP1000
Only when you want to waste your money! It is a good tool, the next generation of SKP900 with epromer and everything what you can can call trendy today. The only problem is, that SuperOBD stopped supporting, so it is chanceless, like the Troyan woodhorse on the Derby of Epsom. Originaly was designed @ superobd, but produced by Lonsdor. It has oddometer, oil change and other options, but costs $500, what is too expensive for a dead tool. Looks & works like the 518ISE. The token system was removed, so I think we lost a good tool with it. RIP.

- TMPro2
Expensive alternative of Tango. The original hardware is cheap - and that's the only thing what's easy to get. The tool has lots of modules (208 at the moment) and the cheapest ones costs €100, but gives lots of modules over 1000 euro. It gives some modules that are able to use such binaries what no ther tool can, but they are insanely expensive. If money doesn't matters, then this is the best choice what you can make; otherwise depends only on your customers what is what you have to build up: Tango or TMPro. The main software without modules and hardware is free to use, but is only able to tell about a binary file when that's good or not. The main hardware is between 89-150 euro. I think I won't pay for this nearly €30.000.- to have the full version. (Maybe cheaper if you buy the whole package together...)

That's it for now, please check back later - will be updated if I know anything important

[Stelaras26]

Mate...Your POST is GREAT!
Cheers and thanks for your time writing this!

[PocketHero]

Thx M8 Just trying to make the choice easier

[PocketHero]

Ok, this is the last part for now, this time I will introduce the automatic key cutting machines:

The List:

- Miracle A5
- Miracle A9 Premium
- X6/V8
- Silca Futura Pro

This tools are ones of the most important part of our job: key blade making. You have to get a CNC machine to do your job fast & easy, but if you make a bad choice, then it'll be an expensive one.

- Miracle A5
One of my friends bought it almost 10 years ago, and uses it till today. In that time it came with a PDA, where you could do the work, and upload it to the machine. Was a good looking solution to sell the machine to yerks, but in the practice it is better when you program the A5 from the keyboard. The main problem is, that this machine can use only one tool at the same time, so you have to change the cutter and the probe always. When it was new, the keys what it made were usually working, when not you had to cut the same key again, and then it was ok. Please do not compare this with todays A5, as I said it is a 10 yrs old model. You can get it from $2000 used.
Today's A5 is an industrial standard, this is the basic model of the automated key cutters. They didn't forgot the PDA, but you can use smartphone, tablet, laptop, anything via bluetooth for programing, or simply its keyboard. Has practical carry points, can be operated from AC and cigarette lighter too. All kinds of adaptors are available between 10-50 bucks/pcs, has its ovn battery what can help when operated from 12V.
You can have it from $3000 + shiping + taxes.

- Miracle A9 PremiumOne of the bests for your shop - for moderate price. I have read, that the most relevant factor @ key copying/making is the boredom, because that's the factor what causes bad copies mostly. This machine can do everything to avoid that: separated probe & cutter, color touch screen, easy to use pictures (for those who can't understand the language) etc. Has 5 different desks for the different tasks (cutting, engraving, dimple & normal keys etc.), and some additional tools for difficulter key shapes (HU66, SX9, Tibbe etc). Some users told me, that it needs to be calibrated too often - but they didn't used the key measuring function, because it isn't switched on @ every keytype. When you switch it on, then you lose 10-20 secs/cut, but the result will be perfect. Has 3 speeds: Brass, Nickel-Silver and Steel. It slows the movement of the desk, avoiding cutter breaks. One special side of this is the fact, that you can only cut metal keys, because it works with electrical contact sensing. If you put a plastic key in, then it will break the probe or the cutter in zero time.
At the beginning you get a lots of accessories: 2 x 1 mm probe & 2 x 2 mm cutter, spare belts in all possible sizes, a HU66 pad, hex wrench, antistatic brush - the usual things. The machine can be updated via wifi or ethernet - please prefer the wired connection, because it freezes allways when you try to update it via wifi. One other important thing is its internal memory, where you can find all the cuts what you have ever made (at least I couldn't reach the poit where it begins to delete the oldest ones). Not only the key type as the X6 does, but everything.
One additional info: It has a battery inside, and can be powered from a car, but it is not recommanded: powered by a 3 KW inverter the cutter rotation always slows down, and stops before cutting the key. If you want to use it in your car, then get an A5 or an X6.
You can buy it from 5000 pounds + VAT, not cheap but worth of its price.

- X6/V8
The best 2nd automatic cutter at the moment. Bought it to use in my car, and it is perfect for this purpose. I think there's nearly nothing new what I could tell about it, because it has its own topic here:http://www.digital-kaos.co.uk/forums...utting-Machine Nothing extraordenary, just a Miracle A5 clone. Needs a bit of experience when you use it, for example it cuts with the 2 mm cutter the HU100 too wide, it won't turn in the ignition. So you have to set the cutter for 2.5 mm (and use the same 2 mm one) to get the good result.
Another problem for me is the cutting memory: it records only the key type without biting. If you stop the actual work, then you have to re-enter the biting, because it can't remember even the last one. When it is too cold for the X6, then the cutter stops too high over the blank, so the cutter won't reach the blank's surface. In this cases I apply a not too strong pressure on the cutter head while moving down to reach the working position. To be honest it has its own faults, but can make a lot of profit for you; only a little care is needed. When you operate it from cigarette lighter, then it needs at least a 100AH battery to be able to work, otherwise you have to run the engine to avoid emergency stops from low voltage.
Maybe it seems that I wrote only about its faults, but I am very satisfyed with the machine. It saves me a lot of time to be able to cut the keys on the roadside, and the price is low enough to buy a second CNC. U can buy this machine from $1200 with free shiping, 5 probe and 10 cutter for $50, HU66, HU64, etc tools from $20.

- Silca Futura Pro
Just tell me what have I done for this punishment! To be honest the machine is very precise @ cutting, but thats all the good side of it. Comes with an ASUS tablet, what needs 5 (!!!) mins to start, and then you have to start the app to be able to do your work. (This time is 1.5 min @ the A9, 1 min @ X6...) The well known InstaCode's simplyfied version is integrated into the sw, with all of its faults.
Has 2 cutters: one for the external cut, one for the internal millings. The most disturbing for me after the software is the decoding. You have to loosen a screw and pull down the measuring pin and fasten it, then you can set the sw to get the cutting datas. For so much money I think it could be made easier. Has all the extras what the others (Tibbe keys, engraving, etc), but I think they've found a way to make it more complicated as necessary. Its price is high enough to leave it in the shop: 7500 quids (+VAT) with the needed adapters (HU162, HU66, SX9, etc).

[ROMIR]

Hi dear,
thank you so mutch for this valuable information !

if you can help me i need an advice : what would be the better choice between SKP900, SBB2, OBDSTAR X100 PRO and OBDSTAR X300 PRO (for key and remote programming i mean)? which one is more reliable and stable ?

other thing: what do you think of the new tools released from OBDSTAR
H100
H108
H110 vag+ RFID addapter
are they worth

Thanks in advance
Regards

[PocketHero]

Hello mate!

To be honest I never met the X-series, so it will be hard to give a correct answer.

After my usual practice I would take the basic tool for first, and that's the CK100 v99.99. With this you can start to practice on cars, and earn some money. As next I would get some headaches, and then buy the X300 Pro3 pad. I repeat I never used this tool, never tried, but it was made from the SKP900, and after that infos what I've found (and the end of the support for the SKP) it seems to be have a better database than the 5.0.
Oh not to forget: there's a hidden trap! For the same money (not spoken from the update fee) you can get the SBB2 and the SKP. These ones are good enough to spend the money on 'em, but the X300 has a PSA pin tool, what (if it works) can come handy often, and has EEPROM-reader support, what the other tools not - or have to buy it separated.

At the moment I can't tell you anything about the H series, please give me some time to get some infos, I promise that I won't 4get

I gave my word, so here is it:

Let's begin with the most important: H110. They've sold only 42 pcs till today, and thats nothing - we speaking about the manufacturer's webshop. There's no relevant feedback, there's nothing, just promises. We all know, that the OBDstar is not trustworthy enough to believe everything what they promise. If you have $320 to risk, then buy it, otherwise - when you calculate with the danger - the FVDI you can get from $100. Does a lot more than just the VAG group, but there's some risk when you use it. If you look around in the forums here in DK you can found lots of posts where the OBDstars faults and mistakes are, so your risk is always there either buying it or not.

@ this point you will have at least 2 tools for programing, and you got a bit experience, and you begin to feel witch direction to go (what kind of cars coming up mostly). I prefer to wait out with the H series instead of investing. It won't be much more expensiver, but you can find trustworthy reports about it.

[ROMIR]

THANKS A LOT , MATE...

[PocketHero]

If you have any questions, please don't hesitate

[kostat]

Thanks for the informations m8.
May i ask you where do you buy remotes for kd900 at 6.5$/pcs?

[PocketHero]

Thanks for the informations m8.
May i ask you where do you buy remotes for kd900 at 6.5$/pcs?

Hello mate!

Not having enough time to search, only one result:

https://www.dhgate.com/product/keydi...arl|0258381706

Mostky we buy B01 or B02 remotes (100+ pcs) on this price, and share it with our workmates. If you don't want to buy so much, then you can found it in 10 packs for $7.5-9 (every type). If you order 500 pcs from the manufacturer in plastic bags then you can even lower this price - sadly this quantity is too much for us.
I hope I could help

[Manta1600]

PocketHero this is the best thread with honest reviews for key tools that I ever saw in one place. Thanks

Can you tell me if CKP900 and CKP1000 are discontinued which tool is better for remote programming?

and is it possible to program remotes for most EU cars without tool ?

Regards

[PocketHero]

Hello Manta!

Ok, here you go:
The SKP900 is a good tool for some remotes, but you can't buy a universal remote programmer. It was and is a good toy, but it depends on the cars what you want to program. For the first tool you have to chose a cheaper basic tool, like SBB2. Contains some remotes, but makes itself usable with lots of other functions. If you want one of the SKPs, then I would prefer the 900, you can get it cheaper (or a used one from ebay) - but if you have enough money, then the 1000 could be a better choice for double price. But I think it is better to have a smartphone, and google every car you wanna work with for the best result - in most cases gives a manual way too.

Best regards

[Manta1600]

Thanks to your thread I already ordered SSB2

but I want to buy one more tool with better coverage for remotes but here is the dilemma what to order

if I must choose between SKP900 for $350 and SKP1000 for $500 I will prefer SKP1000

but if I will pay $500 for SKP1000 it may be better to buy X300 Pro3 that still has updates but updates are paid

and if I pay $500 for X300 Pro3 and must pay for updates it may be better to buy Lonsdor 518 for $1300 which I know you don't like too much.

or may be will be better to buy X300 DP for $1100 for full version + RFID or maybe something else?

I know that you don't use all of these tools but any opinion will be of help

Regards

[adelnooh]

Thank you again for this thread "my toys"