Post Office staff in Easter strike

[super jumbe]

After reading all that I will keep out of it?.

[GastonJ]

After reading all that I will keep out of it?.

As will I m8, very wise

[Bulld0g]

me too

[Snowy79]

I've seen a couple of mates in the same boat. They worked for a company that was losing money and asked to take pay cuts or go part time and refused. The company went tits up within the year and neither one has had a full time job since. It's not a case of laying down and dying. It's surviving that bit longer to put up a fight.

It's up to the individual to decide if they can continue to work for the same wage or risk losing their job in todays climate. There's been a few success stories in the news where employees have taken pay cuts to ride out the storm and it has paid dividends when further down the line the company work load has picked up to an extent where they are back to full time with a pay rises

It's not great but a switched on employee would work hard and make the company a success then they'd have a bargaining chip for pay rises etc. I couldn't imagine anyone on here that employs people offering a pay rise when their company is losing money.

So what do you do? Lay down and die because you can't win, or fight because you believe you can win.
The government want to make decisions and they don't want the little people challenging what they say. If you think you're being wronged, you have to challenge it and fight back.

[GastonJ]

[QUOTE=Snowy79;1915981]I've seen a couple of mates in the same boat. They worked for a company that was losing money and asked to take pay cuts or go part time and refused. The company went tits up within the year and neither one has had a full time job since. It's not a case of laying down and dying. It's surviving that bit longer to put up a fight.

It's up to the individual to decide if they can continue to work for the same wage or risk losing their job in todays climate. There's been a few success stories in the news where employees have taken pay cuts to ride out the storm and it has paid dividends when further down the line the company work load has picked up to an extent where they are back to full time with a pay rises
/QUOTE]

I haven't seen anything saying Royal Mail is making a loss hand over fist yet. Though the country is, and is now more in debt than it was - when do the MP's get their pay cut? Banks are owned mostly by the public, I don't see the government cutting their pay yet, wonder why....

Sorry I am a senior manager in a company and I can tell you even if an employee stuck with us through thick and thin, made us money hand over fist they are still thought of as the stuff on the bottom of peoples shoes. When it comes to personnel I can tell you that there is no morality and no loyalty back to any worker whatsoever. Don't think that your boss is your friend, they aren't They are there to use you when it suits, look up definition of employer - "user"

[Snowy79]

I'm a firm believer Gaston that a pat on the back from a boss is usually a reconaisance for a knife. Like you say in big companies there's no loyalty and that's why I know that if you start biting the hand that feeds you it will just make it easier to shaft you. The Government are just looking for an excuse to off load the Post Office but I wouldn't make it easier for them.

[GastonJ]

They're planning on getting rid of it anyway. Tories normally sell the family silver, gas, telecoms, oil, utilities, steel, railways, mines, housing stock, anything they can lay their hands on that their m8's want to buy really. I'm very surprised the NHS has lasted this long, and doubt it will last much longer tbh. They won't be happy until they're all directors on companies they helped sell to their m8's.

That's why we're a bit messed up atm, everything that a country needs to get itself out of a recession has gone, we have no manufacturing industry to speak of, no mining, no oil, no gas - we have nothing to sell abroad for hard currency. Relying on the bankers, who got us into this, is like having an aligator babysit for you. They lost their money, borrowed ours, and now we're giving them the money to give back to us again.

Kicking those who are in the worst position to defend themselves, public sector and the unemployed and people in need of the most help is not the thing to do and shows the Tories and Liberals up for what they are. As I said I don't see them taking money from banks, far from it they're awarding them PFI's and contracts to pay us back with our own money. Tossers

But getting back on topic. I'm sure striking is the last thing the PO workers want to do, they lose money over it, however they will have tried negotiation and it will have failed. The Strike will be the last attempt to make their feelings known. I support them 100% for that.

[gc1966]

I'm a firm believer Gaston that a pat on the back from a boss is usually a reconaisance for a knife. Like you say in big companies there's no loyalty and that's why I know that if you start biting the hand that feeds you it will just make it easier to shaft you. The Government are just looking for an excuse to off load the Post Office but I wouldn't make it easier for them.

this govt do not give a toss about 40 million plus workers in this country never mind 4000.firms close not because greedy workforces make them unprofitable but managers lose not one groat,when you see the director coming in to work in a fifteen year old ford escort then I would happily stand shoulder to shoulder with that man to keep us afloat.

view your company as a tree with director in the tree tops and follow it down to your workforce as the roots,would you rip up the roots to maintain the health of that tree.

people do not strike for fun,when your back is to the wall you may as well use it as a spring board than a plank to carry your carcass out on.

[thered]

Do you have photocopies of their payslips then?

I don't recall "losing money hand over fist" in the final accounts for the post office, though I could be wrong. The government took their pension last year, and it wasn't because it was loss making either - it was so they could spend it.

Their accounts are here

http://www.postoffice.co.uk/sites/default/files/Post_Office_Limited_2011-12_report_and_%20accounts.pdf.pdf

Profit for the financial year from continuing operations 2012 ?37 million

It's paying premiums to shareholders (the government) that kills them....

old employess are on different contracts thats nothing to do with whats on the payslip there contracts are much more beneficial than the newer employees

and i did say its currently making money but its profits are dropping every year

royal mail is split into 4 parts some were loss makers the post was one, there has been many changes made in postal service in the last ten years, less collections later delivery times, PO counters closing

profits on the whole are in decline every year, mail is in decline due to emails ect

and there was talk of privatiseation when labour was in power its not just a tory thing

its ok going on strike if your in a powerful position and business is booming but its not its declining


what do they want to achieve? no jobs in 5 years?


Makes no odds to me but there is a disparity between older and newer employees when the last strikes were on the newer generation went to work

they were not happy with the older lots contracts and all think they should be the same

[thered]

this govt do not give a toss about 40 million plus workers in this country never mind 4000.firms close not because greedy workforces make them unprofitable but managers lose not one groat,when you see the director coming in to work in a fifteen year old ford escort then I would happily stand shoulder to shoulder with that man to keep us afloat.

view your company as a tree with director in the tree tops and follow it down to your workforce as the roots,would you rip up the roots to maintain the health of that tree.

people do not strike for fun,when your back is to the wall you may as well use it as a spring board than a plank to carry your carcass out on.

Whilst i see your point, and i always rejected every point of any proposal for work put to workers by unions, because they usually are not for your benefit but i do see both sides

I used to deliver bread, fiddling was rife, the job was job and knock for a 10 hours guaranteed contract, my round could be done in 5 1/2 hours to 6 hours tops

they were trying to change it, it was rejected it ended up closed down


bin men same, job and knock 37 hours guaranteed for 4 days work most do around 28 hours, which is why many are not council anymore, that and pensions


old time post men are on 40 hour contracts for around 20-25 hours work

New time employees at post do more hours for less pay than their counterparts

they conveniently ignore these things when they strike

Now i understand that when things have worked like that for so long things are hard to take when they want to change things

but as i have found out myself it sometimes works against you and you end up with nothing

[gc1966]

when a employer takes you on I expect t+c comes up and you do not have a gun put to your head to make you accept and sign on the dotted.

any existing workers may or may not have the same terms,and just cos you accepted inferior terms does not mean they have to,management and the human remains dept obviously see the financial rewards for them and their share holders if a cheaper workforce are employed.

would you strike so that long term employees keep their superior t+c or would you vote against it and see them reduced to your level??

you would find me on the gate defending their rights because to do nothing means you will end up with nothing also when they find someone they can employ on even worse t+c than they employed you.

task and finish is an illegal practice in law but used by employers to encourage risk taking and corner cutting to speed up the job.

[thered]

when a employer takes you on I expect t+c comes up and you do not have a gun put to your head to make you accept and sign on the dotted.

any existing workers may or may not have the same terms,and just cos you accepted inferior terms does not mean they have to,management and the human remains dept obviously see the financial rewards for them and their share holders if a cheaper workforce are employed.

would you strike so that long term employees keep their superior t+c or would you vote against it and see them reduced to your level??

you would find me on the gate defending their rights because to do nothing means you will end up with nothing also when they find someone they can employ on even worse t+c than they employed you.

task and finish is an illegal practice in law but used by employers to encourage risk taking and corner cutting to speed up the job.

Fair point

and im not disagreeing

but from an employer point of view, if you ran a business and you see you product shrinking

your men doing less work, working less hours than paid for


Your profits were shrinking


what do you do?

lay off, reduce wages or fold

[gc1966]

very few places work less hours than paid for and the post office is far from running at a loss,for me if after everyone from the fat cat in the boardroom down to the security guard at the gate have made a living then posting a ?1 yearly profit is good management.

profit is not a dirty word but is dirty business when to obtain it you screw the bottom tier of your business.

[thered]

very few places work less hours than paid for and the post office is far from running at a loss,for me if after everyone from the fat cat in the boardroom down to the security guard at the gate have made a living then posting a ?1 yearly profit is good management.

profit is not a dirty word but is dirty business when to obtain it you screw the bottom tier of your business.

i agree that everything should be inline top middle and bottom rung should all suffer same if thats what is to happen

but the only reasons Royal mail has posted profits recently is due to the new staff being part time and underpaid, when compared to the older guys, less collections and the closure of many community PO counters.

as mail decreases something will have to give

[Snowy79]

The Post Office figures are a bit of a smoke scrren. The arm of the Post Office that is striking is the Crown Post Office. These are running at a ?40,000,000 loss. Don't forget the whole Post Office is state funded to the tune of ?410,000,000 this year alone. It's also part owned by Private Companies.