Parts of Britain 'unrecognisable' due to immigration: UKIP leader

[bobwill]

Seems to me that the middle class with above average wage are all in favor of letting in thousands of low paid workers in they can get there work done on the cheap
But the working class who have seen there wages at best not rising, but most have seen there wages cut a lot down to the minimum wage are against mass cheap labour flooding the country
If it hit the middle class then it soon would be stopped

[GastonJ]

I hope you're not going to tell me that Nigel Farage is up there as a working class person defending the working class

Companies in general like paying the minimum wage so that the taxpayer has to subsidise it with tax credits, working tax credits, family tax credits and all that crap. That is where a great deal of the welfare state funding is going - to subsidise companies who pay sh*t wages knowing they can get away with it. Don't blame the workers (British or EU) for the sh*t conditions imposed on them by the companies making huge profits by paying minimum wage.

[bobwill]

If there was not a flood of cheap labour the companies would have to pay a wage that the working man and woman could live on
With a flood of cheap labour its a race to the bottom for the working man or woman while the middle class gets richer,
Thats why the champagne socialists, when a working man said about immigrants cutting there wages shout RACISTS or BIGOTS
I know one thing the Labour party do not care about the working man or women only at election time
I am all right f**k the workers

[GastonJ]

No. What the companies would do is still pay peanuts and then get television stations, newspapers and MP's to shout about how people are too lazy to take the jobs. The Tories invented the race to the bottom and continue to do so. "Oh look that pension is more than the private pension, we must lower that pension", not raise everyone's pension to a reasonable level Cheap labour at minimum wage remains the same cost - minimum wage does that. Had it not been for minimum wage then it would have been much worse. Time will tell if the Tories will decide to implement the rise in the minimum wage or not.

I note that you use "immigrants" you obviously don't mean workers from the EU then.

[bobwill]

The reason my private pension is so small is because the useless labour chancellor Brown and his two side kicks Milliband and Balls
decided to steal mine thats was before they decided to make GB bankrupt

yes I did mean from EU
Immigrants. A person who comes to live permanently in a foreign country: ie not where he was born

[GastonJ]

yes I did mean from EU Immigrants. A person who comes to live permanently in a foreign country: ie not where he was born

Scotland may be included in that list shortly then, unless you're are going to discriminate? However I'm sure that you are aware that this is nothing new and was in place the minute Ted signed us up for what passes for the EU back then. I don't recall it being a problem back then, nor anyone complaining about people from the UK working in the EU. I suppose it's when it suits a right wing political party (and I use that term very loosely in some cases) that they decide it's wrong and it's all the last governments fault - or indeed the fault of the person who decides to exercise their right to work anywhere they can. When it's been like this for a while, but there was not enough political gain by telling the that. Perhaps they should have read the small print, unless it's taken them this long to learn how to read or become aware of the reality of signing up?

As it is British people have a distinct advantage or two over foreign workers - they already live here, they speak English quite well in most cases, and in some they cases they can actually read English as well. If by coming here, applying for a job and actually getting a job means they "took" the job from the British worker then perhaps the British applicants need to revisit and learn why they never got the job. The minimum wage is just that, if British workers don't want to apply for jobs on minimum wage; well someone else will. If there were no minimum wage companies would pay less. As it is, as a taxpayer, I will be subsidising companies to pay someone the minimum wage, no matter which country they're from and that won't stop until the basic wage is a living wage when tax credits, family working credits and all those benefits stop.

The MEP Anthem

[rds60h]

No. What the companies would do is still pay peanuts and then get television stations, newspapers and MP's to shout about how people are too lazy to take the jobs. The Tories invented the race to the bottom and continue to do so. "Oh look that pension is more than the private pension, we must lower that pension", not raise everyone's pension to a reasonable level Cheap labour at minimum wage remains the same cost - minimum wage does that. Had it not been for minimum wage then it would have been much worse. Time will tell if the Tories will decide to implement the rise in the minimum wage or not.

I note that you use "immigrants" you obviously don't mean workers from the EU then.

I don't think that is true, the Minimum Wage was supposed to be exactly that but instead was used as the standard for a starting wage. It was when the EU migration increased that employers were then able to not even bother increasing wages from the minimum wage.
Also, those coming in from the EU that were or have been recruited through the likes of the EURES scheme : - i) Do not have to be paid Minimum Wage. ii) They are paid to travel to and attend interviews. iii) They are paid a fee for relocating should they take up the job. iv) They are not put off by the lower than minimum wage because they are informed how to claim the benefits they will be entitled to because of the low wage. v) The Employer who employes them is paid a "bonus" for employing them and they are paid a further "bonus" if the employee is retained for a set period.
So no it would not have been worse if it were not for the Minimum Wage, it has been worsened because of it and it has been further eroded by EU rulings and incentives which have been abused by many employers including some very large companies.

[rds60h]

[QUOTE=GastonJ;2242510]Scotland may be included in that list shortly then, unless you're are going to discriminate? However I'm sure that you are aware that this is nothing new and was in place the minute Ted signed us up for what passes for the EU back then. I don't recall it being a problem back then, nor anyone complaining about people from the UK working in the EU. I suppose it's when it suits a right wing political party (and I use that term very loosely in some cases) that they decide it's wrong and it's all the last governments fault - or indeed the fault of the person who decides to exercise their right to work anywhere they can. When it's been like this for a while, but there was not enough political gain by telling the that. Perhaps they should have read the small print, unless it's taken them this long to learn how to read or become aware of the reality of signing up?
As it is British people have a distinct advantage or two over foreign workers - they already live here, they speak English quite well in most cases, and in some they cases they can actually read English as well. If by coming here, applying for a job and actually getting a job means they "took" the job from the British worker then perhaps the British applicants need to revisit and learn why they never got the job. The minimum wage is just that, if British workers don't want to apply for jobs on minimum wage; well someone else will. If there were no minimum wage companies would pay less. As it is, as a taxpayer, I will be subsidising companies to pay someone the minimum wage, no matter which country they're from and that won't stop until the basic wage is a living wage when tax credits, family working credits and all those benefits stop. /QUOTE]



The Scots, Irish and Welsh were the immigrants along with the early Asian and West Indians back in the 50's and 60's and they were all discriminated against by people in the same ways as EU migrants are now !! I know from experience because my parents and I were amonst those who moved down to England in the 50's.
As for don't remember people complaining about people from the UK working in the EU (I know I'm only naming a TV programme, but it was a fairly true reflection of the times) I suggest you watch a few episodes of "Auf Wiedersehen Pet" and see what the Germans thought of the Brits working over there.
I agree with you when you say "as a taxpayer, I will be subsidising companies to pay someone the minimum wage, no matter which country they're from and that won't stop until the basic wage is a living wage when tax credits, family working credits and all those benefits stop." But Employers will never pay a living wage while the government continue making the ordinary working man subsidise them and that is not likely to happen because it is the politicians and their friends and families who are the company owners who are profitting from it.

[Snowy79]

A living wage is already here thanks to the benefits people can claim if they are on a low paid job. You pay someone a low wage you make more profit. You pay more tax on your profit and it's that tax that pays benefits. Pay them more you make less profit so pay less tax which means there's less money in the kitty to pay benefits so they get cut. As there's more money in the public hand prices will increase with inflation so ultimately your better wage means you will be worse off in the long run.

Even the immigrants coming onto the country and working via an agent for less than the minimum wage manage to live with the addition of benefits so maybe we are doing something wrong with our societies expectations.