Ministers defend plan to force jobless to do work

[lfc4life]

BBC News - Ministers defend plan to force jobless to do work

Maybe some light at the end of the tunnel for the work shy....

Good Luck the government into enforcing it

[dctyper]

brilliant idea, giive the lazy barstards a sense of self worth and they will try and better themselves

[Meat-Head]

Too right. We have a fat smelly unemployed bloke come in.

Can't remember what is 'wrong' with him, but why can't he work for the company that keeps ringing with 'junk mail adverts' live!

[Grizz]

finally, im ~~~~in crippled from doing their job on top of my own........



....~~~~ wrong country

[masur123]

Ok flame time if you like

Adolf Hiler had a plan, some if it was clearly wrong, some of it was very right. We all know the wrong parts ( I will explain if you like), but the right parts. i.e. work for the people, people have rights as a nation, are very relevant in anytime. What I feel Hilter did, was to give people the sense of working for your country, working for your people, what he did wrong is clear is obvious to us all, but that does not mean is that his plan for his own country was invlaid.
I feel because of this, we as a people are being steam rolled into accepting things we shouldnt, but in the sense of racism we should not stand up and say what we feel/

Flame away please

[masur123]

Ok flame time if you like

Adolf Hiler had a plan, some if it was clearly wrong, some of it was very right. We all know the wrong parts ( I will explain if you like), but the right parts. i.e. work for the people, people have rights as a nation, are very relevant in anytime. What I feel Hilter did, was to give people the sense of working for your country, working for your people, what he did wrong is clear is obvious to us all, but that does not mean is that his plan for his own country was invlaid.
I feel because of this, we as a people are being steam rolled into accepting things we shouldnt, but in the sense of racism we should not stand up and say what we feel/

Flame away please

When I say own country, I know he was Austrian, but his adoptive country accepted his views as their own...

[Canker_Canison]

Hitler knew how to motivate people. But the final soultion was a little drastic.

A few years ago I spent some time on unemploymment benefit, it was a depressing time. The thought of being given something positive to do, an aid to my self esteem, would of been great.

But I think they're missing something. They are looking at this as a punishment as well as a form of help. If they really want this to work, the people pushed into this should be given a small increase on their benefit. That should help re-enforce the positive action work brings.

Staged correctly this could provide a cheap workforce for combatting the anti-social behaviour found in most deprived areas.

[masur123]

Hitler knew how to motivate people. But the final soultion was a little drastic.

A few years ago I spent some time on unemploymment benefit, it was a depressing time. The thought of being given something positive to do, an aid to my self esteem, would of been great.

But I think they're missing something. They are looking at this as a punishment as well as a form of help. If they really want this to work, the people pushed into this should be given a small increase on their benefit. That should help re-enforce the positive action work brings.

Staged correctly this could provide a cheap workforce for combatting the anti-social behaviour found in most deprived areas.

Ok I read this as, I would work for more benefit, might be wrong... Been unempplyed and was lucky to find a job. My experience from this was someone pay more than UB40 and I was happy, if I had to work for money I may have found work quicker (one way or another)

[Canker_Canison]

My thoughts were along the lines of, if you work...you get more money. If you don't work you get no money.

But this should only be a small amount of money. Maybe an extra ?15 per week.

With luck this will help show them that if they find work, full time work, they will have even more money. And more than that... maybe some self respect & self esteem.

But lets be realistic, some people will never develop any self respect or self esteem.

[HoTTDubbER]

how can they force people into work when theres no jobs for these poor people

what there looking for is slave labour and giving the unemployed the same punishment as a criminal would get for robbing an old lady, stealing a car , assulting somebody or selling drugs on the street

what i dont understand about that article is if there going to force unemployed people into 30hours 9 till 5 work , when exactly are they supposed to look and find work , as most employers work between 9 and 5 and if there cleaning bins or sweeping streets for the local council when do these skilled unemployed workers go about rebuilding there life , they would be affectively be stuck in the lowest paid dead end job in the world ... as dont most people get stuck in dead end jobs because they lack the time to find better jobs?

how many employers do you know that pay 65? a week for 30 hours work ? ...... employed people would you work 30 hours a week for 65? , hell no you wouldn't i know i wouldn't

theres a minimum wage in this country that the people who set it are blaightently ignoring and effectively breaking there own law ???

if they expect people to work 30 hours a week then shouldn't they be paid minimum wage

the conservatives are a joke , stuck up rich boys that have never done a real days work in there life and havnt a clue how hard it is for the average man and family

worse thing that ever happened was let these idiots try and run the country they havnt a clue

[chroma]

how can they force people into work when theres no jobs for these poor people

what there looking for is slave labour and giving the unemployed the same punishment as a criminal would get for robbing an old lady, stealing a car , assulting somebody or selling drugs on the street

what i dont understand about that article is if there going to force unemployed people into 30hours 9 till 5 work , when exactly are they supposed to look and find work , as most employers work between 9 and 5 and if there cleaning bins or sweeping streets for the local council when do these skilled unemployed workers go about rebuilding there life , they would be affectively be stuck in the lowest paid dead end job in the world ... as dont most people get stuck in dead end jobs because they lack the time to find better jobs?

how many employers do you know that pay 65? a week for 30 hours work ? ...... employed people would you work 30 hours a week for 65? , hell no you wouldn't i know i wouldn't

theres a minimum wage in this country that the people who set it are blaightently ignoring and effectively breaking there own law ???

if they expect people to work 30 hours a week then shouldn't they be paid minimum wage

the conservatives are a joke , stuck up rich boys that have never done a real days work in there life and havnt a clue how hard it is for the average man and family

worse thing that ever happened was let these idiots try and run the country they havnt a clue

So people sat on their arse for six months to a year taking money out my pocket whilst driving deliveries for the local chinese should be allowed to continue in your book? because thats whats being targeted here.
Not some skilled tradesman whos found himself down on his luck.

Its not like its going to be immediate, things will definately be gradual, six months unemployed? on to "New deal" for re-training etc.
Another six months? then its about time to go out and earn my taxes i say.
If youve not found a new job within a year then that shows a complete lack of willing on your part, regardless of the "economic climate" theres plenty of work to be had, ive recently found myself in the situation and managed to be unemployed for less than a day before finding work.
Shitty work, definately but between working 12hr shifts im actively looking for another job that pays better, all the while safe in the knowledge that im able to pay my bills whilst doing so and not scrounging from the system.

I know plenty of people whove never had a job, theyre skilled workers when it comes to navigating the system, and put as much effort into shirking and skiving as most do into hard physical labour, but thats about it, no interest in going out and earning their keep and completely happy to live off my taxes, those are the ones who will actualy feel a difference. Not someone whos recently out of a job and knows the value of a days graft.

Im no fan of the tories by any stretch, but so far i cant fault em

[HoTTDubbER]

i understand parts of where your coming from but not everyone caught on benifits delivers takeaways for spare change and not everyone has spent there entire life claiming there will be a lot of innocents caught up in this proposal who have worked there entire life

its all dependant as of where u are situated also you must remember.

im employed and this doesnt affect me i have spent time on benefits as my business went bust a few years back , and there was no work for my line of work for me to go into then (its even worse now) and newdeal just wanted to train me a skilled worked as a security guard , or a cleaner ,hence why i stared a new chain of business's that required no capital and got the hell outta there

not everyone has the skills to go at it alone and i sympathise with them as i know how hard it can be

if i had been forced to work 30+ hours for peanuts a week i would have never got back on my feet and would be standing in a coop right now following kids nicking mars bars

i also stand by what i said about min wage by all means send these people on long term benefits that you speak of to do council work ect
but also dont expect them to work for nothing i dont believe anyone should have to work for any less than min wage
the min wage law is in effect for a reason ... if the torys want 30hours work out of em a week them pay them what they would earn on min wage for 30 hours a week

after all going to work travelling and eating while at work costs money , how can you expect people to live , run there homes ect pay there bills and travel to work 30 hours a week for 60? a week , that's outrageous

not making an argument just voicing my opinions

[msocsci]

Here is my slant on it. I am currently an unemployed single parent (male) I have been a single parent for the last 12 years since my kids were very young. I spent the last 6 years before my unemployment going to college and university, were I graduated with a 1st class honours degree.
In the last 2 years I have applied for over 500 vacancies many of which I was over qualified for. Not one of the companies has had the common decency to reply with even a rejection letter. I am 47 and it seems no one wants to give me a chance. I run a local boys football team so I don't sit on my arse doing nothing, I think I contribute to society through this.
When I was at uni I had to tailor my subjects around the kids school time as I could not find any childcare within my area, all the spaces had been taken in all the childcare providers.
I had a very well paying job prior to taking on the kids and tried to keep working at first. I could only do this with the help of my mother who looked after them when they were young. My mother became ill and could not look after them, so I had to, reluctantly, leave my job and go onto benefits.
I am old enough to remember the last tory attack on the less well off, it was horrible and disgusting that a priviledged few could cause so much misery for millions of decent people.
So what jobs will they force me into as slave labour? Cleaning graffitti, streets or working in a supermarket? Nothing wrong with that you say, but if the jobs can be found for unemployed people why are they not there as a source of gainful employment?
And if the unemployed are to do these types of jobs, I just know that local councils will abuse it to lay of thousands of low paid workers, they did it in the 1980s so will do it again.
The tories are just using their age old philosophy here, divide the working class and conquer them. Today the unemployed, tomorrow every worker (working class) in the country.
If your lucky enough to be in a job the tory attack will hit you soon, they will begin to attack wages and drive them down to accomodate big business. You can already see your pensions taking a hit. They will decimate working class areas, again., This will make it inevitable that crime increases as people cannot afford the basics let alone luxuries, so everyone, not just the poor, will end up suffering more.
Why do you think you are paying more for everything, groceries, petrol, utility bills etc? It has little to do with a recession, why is it mainly the rich who are the ones who gain most from the lean times and the poor who lose most? I would argue the whole situation has been engineered by rich men to enable that to happen.

Your tax is used much more to keep the rich in their very priviledged positions of power, economically and politically, than it is used to help unemployed people.
Take a wee look at social history, there has always been a rich mans argument concerning deserving and undeserving poor. This is a divide and conquer policy and most people will just let it happen.
Sorry for the rant

[badapple]

I dought this will ever work. You cannot force someone into doing something they dont want to do.
Human right will come into play and the E.U will love this.
You cant even put criminals in jail these days.

If I was on benefits and refuse to be forces into doing something I dont want to do, then my benefits will be cut/stopped for 3 months. How will I survive?
I will committ crimes to survive!
Watch how crime soars.

[bonus2010]

Forcing Jobless to Work for less than NMW

I feel the proposal to have the long-term unemployed working for 30 hours @ ?65 is absolutely shocking! (I wonder if it would be in breach of human rights)

It would be a better suggestion to pay at least the minimum hourly rate. Given NMW hourly rate = ?5.93
That should only be 11 hours.
(All travel to work expenses should be paid)

It is wrong to treat the long-term unemployed as criminals or less than criminals. I heard recently it was proposed
to give prisoners work at the minimum hourly rate.

The other point is, why restrict the type of work offered to sweeping up the streets?

msocsci has clearly demonstrated that the unemployed have
skills, qualifications and experience to offer. So why waste that resource?

Incidentally, I've met many unemployed graduates who have struggled to find work.

Maybe a better idea is to abolish the welfare benefits system alltogether, and instead give all claimants a job
in the public sector, at least at the minimum hourly rate or the going hourly rate, with the number of
hours to match their benefit entitlement amount. This would put an end to public sector workers
doing overtime, like the refuse collector in Birmingham I heard receiving an income in
excess of ?50,000 (bonus, O/T, attendance etc...)

The government could then save money by closing the most depressing places
in Britain .... the JobcentrePlus, and instead spend public money on more
worthwhile beneficial causes.

And before you tell me Britain couldn't afford this, to have full guaranteed employment, well let me tell you
Britain was the fourth, but is still now the sixth richest economy in the world!


I feel like Rab C. Nesbit ....... what was the question again?




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