Bedroom tax, new thread !

[Saltire]

Why can't those that are under occupying take in a tenant and do their part for every other persons human rights. We're seeing cut backs in social care and respite care for those that can't help themselves due to selfish individuals wanting more than they need in the vast majority of cases.

would you be happy with your 80 year old mother taking in a 30 year old guy just to take up a spare room and also share same bathroom etc ? talk sense man, for gods sake man, when will people see a wee bit of sense ?

yes, its not right having 1 person in a house with 5 spare rooms, but maybe 1 spare room for the family and friends to stay every other night when they visit is fine, people need to start thinking reality and stop talking garbage man, my opinion.

edit, not sure if it applies to pensioners, so I will say 1 year before your a pensioner.

[Snowy79]

Talking sense is having an organised system to ensure suitable people share accommodation so we can save enough money so my 80 year old Mohher can live in sheltered accommodation and get the care she may need. Of course it doesn't sound as good to those that don't lose services that are life saving as opposed to giving a little extra luxury. The amount of shi@e I read about examples of negative matches,junkies, sex offenders, thieves etc sharing under occupied accommodation. If that's a snap shot of society maybe we shouldn't be supplying any of them accommodation.

Give me me a valid reason why it wouldn't free up suitable accommodation if you filled up surplus accommodation this way. There would be no issue with a lack of accommodation if this system was used. I'm sure it could even be organised so that those who can afford the additional contribution could pay it and stay where they are.

would you be happy with your 80 year old mother taking in a 30 year old guy just to take up a spare room and also share same bathroom etc ? talk sense man, for gods sake man, when will people see a wee bit of sense ?

yes, its not right having 1 person in a house with 5 spare rooms, but maybe 1 spare room for the family and friends to stay every other night when they visit is fine, people need to start thinking reality and stop talking garbage man, my opinion.

edit, not sure if it applies to pensioners, so I will say 1 year before your a pensioner.

[rds60h]

Talking sense is having an organised system to ensure suitable people share accommodation so we can save enough money so my 80 year old Mohher can live in sheltered accommodation and get the care she may need. Of course it doesn't sound as good to those that don't lose services that are life saving as opposed to giving a little extra luxury. The amount of shi@e I read about examples of negative matches,junkies, sex offenders, thieves etc sharing under occupied accommodation. If that's a snap shot of society maybe we shouldn't be supplying any of them accommodation.

Give me me a valid reason why it wouldn't free up suitable accommodation if you filled up surplus accommodation this way. There would be no issue with a lack of accommodation if this system was used. I'm sure it could even be organised so that those who can afford the additional contribution could pay it and stay where they are.

Why not send them all into a poor house like they did back in the early 1900's ? That will free up more properties !

" An organised system to ensure suitable people share accommodation"

You are talking about a system to be organised by the government do you really think they or whoever they sold the scheme out to would even consider suitability ?

"The amount of shi@e I read about examples of negative matches, junkies, sex offenders, thieves etc sharing under occupied accommodation. If that's a snap shot of society maybe we shouldn't be supplying any of them accommodation."

That actually is a snapshot of society in the areas many of us live in !!

"I'm sure it could even be organised so that those who can afford the additional contribution could pay it and stay where they are."

I'm afraid that sums up the reasoning behind your opinion, and that is "I'm alright Jack ! It won't affect me !" ..............I was going to put "Sod the rest" in there but I don't think would be a true statement about your feelings, but when you think you are safe, secure and financially OK it is difficult to imagine yourself in these situations.
But believe me it really doesn't take much for those foundations to crumble and for you to be in that dire situation, I know because it has happened to me.

[Snowy79]

Who is to say it's the Government that will say who lives with who? I'm pretty certain there are plenty of charities, support groups, friends and family who know other decent people looking for people to share accomodation with. Just amongst a few of my mates I could name three who have more rooms than they need, who if they moved into the one three bedroom house would free up two, two bedroon properties. Multiply that throughout the country and I'm pretty certain you can see the housing situation improving.

As for the Junkies etc being a snap shot of many areas who knows maybe if money wasn't being wasted elesewhere we could fund a decent Police force and punishment/treatment service. I see it daily in areas of Glasgow and Edinburgh where the tax payer has paid to have old council accomodation flatened and replaced by modern houses with back and front gardens then 6 months down the line the vermin have trashed the properties. These are the ones the Government should tell where to live and if they don't like it become a responsible member of society and earn respect.

There are plenty of people that can afford the extra room if they want an extra room that much. Remember there are plenty of working families living in council accomodation.


I'm also aware how easy it is to fall on hard times as I'm sure you're aware that if you've worked hard for what you've got; if it does go pear shaped you're shafted ten times as much as someone who's sponged off the system and never worked a day in their life. If you've paid all your taxes and have a family home then can't keep up the payments the house is sold. You then have to live off any profits without getting support until you've spent all your hard earn't money. In short you pay your way then have to spend your savings before the government step in. I'm in that boat as I spent 24 years in the armed forces before being made redundant. Due to my pension which I'd paid for and been taxed on I've had to pay for everything I have from further education courses at Uni and accomodation. I've shared accomodation and done shit jobs as I've pride. Maybe this is why I'm not a left wing sympathiser. Too many people think the World owes them something, well they're in for a shock as there's only so much money and it's going to get a lot worse.

Why not send them all into a poor house like they did back in the early 1900's ? That will free up more properties !

" An organised system to ensure suitable people share accommodation"

You are talking about a system to be organised by the government do you really think they or whoever they sold the scheme out to would even consider suitability ?

"The amount of shi@e I read about examples of negative matches, junkies, sex offenders, thieves etc sharing under occupied accommodation. If that's a snap shot of society maybe we shouldn't be supplying any of them accommodation."

That actually is a snapshot of society in the areas many of us live in !!

"I'm sure it could even be organised so that those who can afford the additional contribution could pay it and stay where they are."

I'm afraid that sums up the reasoning behind your opinion, and that is "I'm alright Jack ! It won't affect me !" ..............I was going to put "Sod the rest" in there but I don't think would be a true statement about your feelings, but when you think you are safe, secure and financially OK it is difficult to imagine yourself in these situations.
But believe me it really doesn't take much for those foundations to crumble and for you to be in that dire situation, I know because it has happened to me.

[flyingpig]

would you be happy with your 80 year old mother taking in a 30 year old guy just to take up a spare room and also share same bathroom etc ? talk sense man, for gods sake man, when will people see a wee bit of sense ?

yes, its not right having 1 person in a house with 5 spare rooms, but maybe 1 spare room for the family and friends to stay every other night when they visit is fine, people need to start thinking reality and stop talking garbage man, my opinion.

edit, not sure if it applies to pensioners, so I will say 1 year before your a pensioner.

It doesn't apply to pensioners.....

[flyingpig]

Why can't those that are under occupying take in a tenant and do their part for every other persons human rights. We're seeing cut backs in social care and respite care for those that can't help themselves due to selfish individuals wanting more than they need in the vast majority of cases.

Some tenants can - and it depends on the lease you have with your Housing Association. Where I work we are giving people that opportunity to be able to take a lodger in. It would be a private agreement between them and their tenant, and they would have to pay tax on any earnings.

[Snowy79]

I read also that they can gain up to ?54 tax free before having to pay anything. A nice little earner if you ask me.

Some tenants can - and it depends on the lease you have with your Housing Association. Where I work we are giving people that opportunity to be able to take a lodger in. It would be a private agreement between them and their tenant, and they would have to pay tax on any earnings.

[Saltire]

Snowy, you need to be careful in how you use the word "spongers", I know exactly what you mean mate but some people are not spongers and the regime nowdays has got so difficult to get on any benefits letalone disabled payments etc that its extremely difficult and maybe or maybe not rightly so to catch all these "spongers" out, yes, I don't like them either, gone are the days though that everyone in the street, well the streets that I know in the roughest and toughest areas of Glasgow, gone are those days when everyone thought it was great if others screwed the system by the bucketload of cash, it doesn't really happen that much anymore, its too difficult to get away with.

There are a group of people though that concern me and that is the ones that are borderline forever partially disabled but the system will not budge and give them help at all, that is terrible and shocking and I know plenty people in that boat.

Also, a lot of these people who just dont make the strict grades to get the extra financial help are left floundering with next to no money at all yet still have to try and look after themselves on basic benefits and even a fit person couldn't survive on the basic benefits, when you calculate it a person has about 20p per day to live on and that's them sitting in a house with no electricity on or gas and no tv, no lights no nuffin and maybe the odd day if they are lucky have enough money to buy a can of dog food to eat (yes dog food is better for you than the crap that pennies can buy).

What really sickens me though is a lot of these people have family that have worked hard their whole life in factories or school cleaners etc and paid contributions into the system and litrally never ever took a day off work once in their lifes and then they retire and die, yet maybe as I say, their son or daughter just cant work for whatever reason but also cannot fit the stupid grades to get some extra help from Westminster, its ferckin ridiculous !

So these sons and daughters I speak of, they sit there with a can of dog food etc if lucky, and their family have paid thousands and thousand and thousands of pounds into the system for a lifetime, right ?

Why cant these sons and daughters then say well under the circumstances, my family have paid all this money for a lifetime, surely that means they should be able to get some help on that bases ? wouldn't you even agree on that ?

Remember that these funds that everyone pays into are for everyone in the country, not just the priveledged few, I do not think its right at all, it is far from right man !

I do agree with you about true scroungers though that are fit and able.

But, these other people I speak of that are very vulnerable, they should not have the added burden of even thinking about 1 spare bedroom or having to take in a rapist, murders, psychopath or junkie etc to pay for that extra room, that is the most stupid thing I have heard in my life man !

Ok, lets say everyone agrees to take in this crazy lodger, the government should then be held liable for all damages to the property and surrounding property and also fully legally liable to any harm that the tenant may comes to if attacked or raped etc etc etc, that would run into billions of pounds because believe me, there would be claims made constantly !

Or the government the wants to employ people could create jobs and have a security guard on each house 24/7 and pay them a decent wage to make sure the tenant is safe, again that would costs billions of pounds.

This is a totally unworkable and crazy tax that has been brought in that the government have not even thought about the impact of, they are idiots !

As one user "rds60h" says, the only people who seem to think this is a good idea are either "I don't care as I'm alright Jack" people, or people who I just cant figure out if they have half a brain cell at all.

From some of the comments in here I read, why don't we just send everyone to concentration camps and be done with them, because that is exactly what the governments of the UK and the USA are trying to do right now and until everyone gets their head out of the sand and stop hiding, then this is what will happen as its already started a long time ago with people taking their own lifes because they just cant take the strain anymore of this poxy world we live in !!!!!!!!!

[Saltire]

ATOS reassessing Francesca Martinez but there's no cure for brain damage: Ros Wynne Jones Real Britain column - Ros Wynne Jones - Mirror Online

[flyingpig]

It is about getting the cut off point right. There has to be one, and wherever it is there will be people who will feel aggrieved.

This is a good thing and it is fair. The mistake the government has made is they never phased it in and never done enough consultation with disabled people. There are many disabled people, who by the system are classed as disabled and say they cannot work - you quite often hear that as the 1st thing said - I can't work I'm disabled. I work with a few members of staff who are disabled and they do a great job. We had the paralympics with people who lost limbs - yet they are doing something extraordinary. If they can do that - and keep that in mind - there is a lot of people who will class themselves as disabled but can still perform a fucntion / job.

There are lots of cases that get mistaken through the Atos review system and this is becuase Humans are involved. We all have different ways of implementing systems and processes and not all things are black and white. What you are seeing as reported is one side of a very complicated story - to get a balanced view you would need to listen to the other side. We should never make judgements without listening to the other side and other people involved.

My lovely poor mother in law is on breathing aparatus, has angina, heart disease, diabetes can't walk 100 yards. Yet she does a 37 hour week in a good job. We can if we want - we can acheive - the system needs to change - and there will always be people caught up in the system as systems are never ever perfect.

[Saltire]

Shipping containers rented out as London homes | Mail Online

This honestly has to be a joke, right ? wait till I check, hmmm, nope, its not april fools day !

[flyingpig]

Shipping containers rented out as London homes | Mail Online

This honestly has to be a joke, right ? wait till I check, hmmm, nope, its not april fools day !

I think that is a great invention.... --- Surely that is good enough for short stay places. It is functional has all the bits. It's never going to make a home, but I would say it is about the same as some city centre flats that I have seen.

[cgscott]

Shipping containers rented out as London homes | Mail Online

This honestly has to be a joke, right ? wait till I check, hmmm, nope, its not april fools day !

Next invention gonna be a giant tin opener.watch this space.

[Saltire]

I think that is a great invention.... --- Surely that is good enough for short stay places. It is functional has all the bits. It's never going to make a home, but I would say it is about the same as some city centre flats that I have seen.

Ok, tell you what, why dont you go and live in one and I will come and live in your property, I can only guess by the way you speak that your comfortable in a private owned house etc, correct ? In other words like the other user said earlier "I'm alright jack so I dont give a monkeys about anyone else that isnt as fortunate as me", .

Anyway, thats not my buisness, and I aint interested in it either, but no, I do not agree with you for one second that staying in a Steel Shipping container is right for anyone, not even a dog, I would rather die first.

Its an absolute insult to humans that are born and bred in the UK, maybe if the stupid English Government would have closed the borders totally on people coming into this country then we wouldnt be in the state we are in now, and then as if that wasnt bad enough the majority of English people voted the Tories in, WOW man !

How Stupid is that and now they all regret it, lets hope they dont make the same mistake again eh ?

[rds60h]

Snowy79
"I'm also aware how easy it is to fall on hard times as I'm sure you're aware that if you've worked hard for what you've got; if it does go pear shaped you're shafted ten times as much as someone who's sponged off the system and never worked a day in their life. If you've paid all your taxes and have a family home then can't keep up the payments the house is sold. You then have to live off any profits without getting support until you've spent all your hard earn't money. In short you pay your way then have to spend your savings before the government step in"
I have basically been through that after working full time for almost 40 years from the day I left school, I have served an apprenticeship, been in middle management in a huge multi national working throughout Europe, and at the other end of the scale I have been a production line worker and a delivery driver and I didn't mind which job I done because I was earning and providing for my family.
But I was brought up to always watch out for and help those who are worse off, but I was also taught not to be taken in by those who are quite happy to take advantage. So......................................"I see it daily in areas of Glasgow and Edinburgh where the tax payer has paid to have old council accomodation flatened and replaced by modern houses with back and front gardens then 6 months down the line the vermin have trashed the properties. These are the ones the Government should tell where to live and if they don't like it become a responsible member of society and earn respect."
I can only fully agree with you about this type of "vermin" but it is these type of people that should be targeted not the ordinary honest person who has fallen on hard times, all too often it is a case of punish everyone to get the guilty but because it is punish everyone the actual punishment usually hardly affects the guilty.
Almost every working man and woman can tell you about a situation of "Look at those scrounging F******, boozing, shooting up, thieving, working on the side, etc." Those in power need to climb down out of their ivory towers and see what is actually happening on the streets in the real world and target the real culprits.
Another example could be abuse of Disability Living Allowance, instead of the expensive and brutal use of ATOS and the so called "medical assessments" they should sit and watch the Disabled Parking Spaces in towns and supermarkets and watch many able bodied people abusing the system, some may only abusing the Parking Pass but they are still abusing the system. They would catch many more who abuse the system by doing this than stopping genuine peoples support and money and even pushing some to the point of suicide.
There are some who are owed a living because they have done their bit but are now not able to, but there are other who just take advantage irrespective of what position they are in. After all there are companies taking advantage of cheap, free or subsidised labour and also those "working" on the side or illegally and so they are making even more out of the situation.
The guilty on both sides of the problem need to be identified and punished instead of the blanket use of the "Look what we're doing, vote for us." solutions.