can money make you a big club?? .i.e Man City?

[janobi]

Yes is the simplest answer. Money brings you success, which catapults the club into the big league. Many clubs have achieved this over time, Liverpool in the 80s, Manchester Utd in the 90s, Chelsea in the 00's, perhaps now will be City's turn.

History teaches us that you buy the title. Blackburn did it, Newcastle nearly did it, Manchester Utd have been doing it for years, as did Chelsea and Arsenal.

However I dont accept that the 5 biggest include Celtic or Rangers. Whilst they might be steeped in history, and Celtic were the first UK team to win the European Cup, they are living off their history, rather than making new history. No offence to any of the Scottish fans here, but both of the old firm would struggle in the PL, and would likely get relegated. And yes the money is bigger in the PL than the SPL, but the skill is also greater

[yasminandrio]

Yes is the simplest answer. Money brings you success, which catapults the club into the big league. Many clubs have achieved this over time, Liverpool in the 80s, Manchester Utd in the 90s, Chelsea in the 00's, perhaps now will be City's turn.

History teaches us that you buy the title. Blackburn did it, Newcastle nearly did it, Manchester Utd have been doing it for years, as did Chelsea and Arsenal.

However I dont accept that the 5 biggest include Celtic or Rangers. Whilst they might be steeped in history, and Celtic were the first UK team to win the European Cup, they are living off their history, rather than making new history. No offence to any of the Scottish fans here, but both of the old firm would struggle in the PL, and would likely get relegated. And yes the money is bigger in the PL than the SPL, but the skill is also greater

Money does bring success i agree with that, But can you answer me this, You say that Man United Have been Buying the Title for years when did or have Man Utd bought the title, Cause if there have how come it took us so long to over turn Liverpool reign, I would of loved to have done it sooner, To be fair, Here a list for the last 5 years of prem spends

# 2006 - 2011 Purchased Gross --- Sold --- Nett --- Per Season

1 Manchester City --- ?455,670,000 --- ?75,550,000 --- ?380,120,000 --- ?76,024,000
2 Chelsea --- ?199,500,000 --- ?101,800,000 --- ?97,700,000 --- ?19,540,000
3 Tottenham --- ?230,300,000 --- ?135,100,000 --- ?95,200,000 --- ?19,040,000
4 Aston Villa --- ?145,350,000 --- ?67,650,000 --- ?77,700,000 --- ?15,540,000
5 Sunderland --- ?122,850,000 --- ?65,725,000 --- ?57,125,000 --- ?11,425,000
6 Liverpool --- ?253,240,000 --- ?205,280,000 --- ?47,960,000 --- ?9,592,000
7 Stoke City --- ?54,725,000 --- ?10,920,000 --- ?43,805,000 --- ?8,761,000
8 West Ham --- ?105,070,000 --- ?68,225,000 --- ?36,845,000 --- ?7,369,000
9 Fulham --- ?63,675,000 --- ?28,875,000 --- ?34,800,000 --- ?6,960,000
10 Bolton --- ?52,150,000 --- ?26,750,000 --- ?25,400,000 --- ?5,080,000
11 Wolves --- ?33,525,000 --- ?8,225,000 --- ?25,300,000 --- ?5,060,000
12 West Bromwich Albion --- ?46,585,000 --- ?27,560,000 --- ?19,025,000 --- ?3,805,000
15 Everton --- ?64,750,500 --- ?48,250,000 --- ?16,500,500 --- ?3,300,100
14 Manchester United --- ?164,300,000 --- ?150,850,000 --- ?13,450,000 --- ?2,690,000
15 Birmingham City --- ?64,875,000 --- ?53,850,000 --- ?11,025,000 --- ?2,205,000
16 Blackpool --- ?4,700,000 --- ?250,000 --- ?4,450,000 --- ?890,000
17 Wigan --- ?58,500,000 --- ?60,200,000 --- -?1,700,000 --- -?340,000
18 Blackburn Rovers --- ?41,752,000 --- ?47,290,000 --- -?5,538,000 --- -?1,107,600
19 Arsenal --- ?85,150,000 --- ?113,000,000 --- -?27,850,000 --- -?5,570,000
20 Newcastle --- ?63,100,000 --- ?112,650,000 --- -?49,550,000 --- -?9,910,000

Hull ?23,250,000 ?9,225,000 ?14,025,000 ?2,805,000
Middlesbrough ?79,700,000 ?64,850,000 ?14,850,000 ?2,970,000
Burnley ?13,090,000 ?10,575,000 ?2,515,000 ?503,000
Leeds United ?2,100,000 ?12,800,000 -?10,700,000 -?2,140,000
Portsmouth ?75,600,000 ?104,520,000 -?28,920,000 -?5,784,000

Average Spend for the last 5 years for Man United Is 2.69m
Well if thats buying the league well done United

[janobi]

Money does bring success i agree with that, But can you answer me this, You say that Man United Have been Buying the Title for years when did or have Man Utd bought the title, Cause if there have how come it took us so long to over turn Liverpool reign, I would of loved to have done it sooner, To be fair, Here a list for the last 5 years of prem spends

# 2006 - 2011 Purchased Gross --- Sold --- Nett --- Per Season

1 Manchester City --- ?455,670,000 --- ?75,550,000 --- ?380,120,000 --- ?76,024,000
2 Chelsea --- ?199,500,000 --- ?101,800,000 --- ?97,700,000 --- ?19,540,000
3 Tottenham --- ?230,300,000 --- ?135,100,000 --- ?95,200,000 --- ?19,040,000
4 Aston Villa --- ?145,350,000 --- ?67,650,000 --- ?77,700,000 --- ?15,540,000
5 Sunderland --- ?122,850,000 --- ?65,725,000 --- ?57,125,000 --- ?11,425,000
6 Liverpool --- ?253,240,000 --- ?205,280,000 --- ?47,960,000 --- ?9,592,000
7 Stoke City --- ?54,725,000 --- ?10,920,000 --- ?43,805,000 --- ?8,761,000
8 West Ham --- ?105,070,000 --- ?68,225,000 --- ?36,845,000 --- ?7,369,000
9 Fulham --- ?63,675,000 --- ?28,875,000 --- ?34,800,000 --- ?6,960,000
10 Bolton --- ?52,150,000 --- ?26,750,000 --- ?25,400,000 --- ?5,080,000
11 Wolves --- ?33,525,000 --- ?8,225,000 --- ?25,300,000 --- ?5,060,000
12 West Bromwich Albion --- ?46,585,000 --- ?27,560,000 --- ?19,025,000 --- ?3,805,000
15 Everton --- ?64,750,500 --- ?48,250,000 --- ?16,500,500 --- ?3,300,100
14 Manchester United --- ?164,300,000 --- ?150,850,000 --- ?13,450,000 --- ?2,690,000
15 Birmingham City --- ?64,875,000 --- ?53,850,000 --- ?11,025,000 --- ?2,205,000
16 Blackpool --- ?4,700,000 --- ?250,000 --- ?4,450,000 --- ?890,000
17 Wigan --- ?58,500,000 --- ?60,200,000 --- -?1,700,000 --- -?340,000
18 Blackburn Rovers --- ?41,752,000 --- ?47,290,000 --- -?5,538,000 --- -?1,107,600
19 Arsenal --- ?85,150,000 --- ?113,000,000 --- -?27,850,000 --- -?5,570,000
20 Newcastle --- ?63,100,000 --- ?112,650,000 --- -?49,550,000 --- -?9,910,000

Hull ?23,250,000 ?9,225,000 ?14,025,000 ?2,805,000
Middlesbrough ?79,700,000 ?64,850,000 ?14,850,000 ?2,970,000
Burnley ?13,090,000 ?10,575,000 ?2,515,000 ?503,000
Leeds United ?2,100,000 ?12,800,000 -?10,700,000 -?2,140,000
Portsmouth ?75,600,000 ?104,520,000 -?28,920,000 -?5,784,000

Average Spend for the last 5 years for Man United Is 2.69m
Well if thats buying the league well done United

Dude your delusional. I could run off about 100 players that you have bought to help you get the title, or did this whole crop of players come through the ranks? lmfao.

The only reason your net spend is so low, because you sold one player for 80m!! It kinda rounds the figures down somewhat.

In the last 3 seasons alone, they have spent nearly 50m!!

30m for rooney
30m for berbatov
15m for carrick
12m for chicarito
15m for anderson
28m for veron
30m for ferdinand
18m for de gea
15m for saha

The list goes on and on and on. And those are just the ones I can be bothered to type, there are many many more. Some flops too. Every club buys the title. Its that simple.

Manchester United Transfers | Premiership Transfers

Kinda defeats your argument, as it clearly shows that Man Utd have spent above and beyond most years to win. I make it over 620 million since 92.

And in any season where they sold more than they bought, that comes to 79305000. So 79 million, so I would say thats a massive difference in what they have bought to what they have spent. So yes Man Utd have bought the title!

Combined Totals ?430,250,000 ?291,090,000 ?139,160,000
I make that a difference of 160m roughly. Still say they didnt buy the title?

[boomer39]

still depends on what you mean by a big club... ok, blackburn "bought" title under the "king"
but would you class them as a bigger club than everton? would you class city as a bigger club than everton after winning their 1st trophy for 30 years? in my humble opinion, the big clubs have always been big clubs...and will always be big clubs...no matter how much cash they have or dont have.

[yasminandrio]

Dude your delusional. I could run off about 100 players that you have bought to help you get the title, or did this whole crop of players come through the ranks? lmfao.

The only reason your net spend is so low, because you sold one player for 80m!! It kinda rounds the figures down somewhat.

In the last 3 seasons alone, they have spent nearly 50m!!

30m for rooney
30m for berbatov
15m for carrick
12m for chicarito
15m for anderson
28m for veron
30m for ferdinand
18m for de gea
15m for saha

The list goes on and on and on. And those are just the ones I can be bothered to type, there are many many more. Some flops too. Every club buys the title. Its that simple.

Mate your wrong we buy and sell players and where the ~~~~ have you taken your info from as its not correct, on how much we paid for certain players!! Here a list of spends since 1992 - end of this season, Thats not buying the league mate its business we bring a lot of players though the ranks... As you can win it with KIDS and thats a FACT

#Net Spend 92 - 2010Purchased GrossSoldNettPer Season1Chelsea?661,640,000?203,875,000?457,765,000?24,092,8952Manchester City?573,180,000?138,303,000?434,877,000?22,888,2633Tottenham?399,050,000?201,717,500?197,332,500?10,385,9214Liverpool?495,805,000?304,920,000?190,885,000?10,046,5795Manchester United?430,250,000?291,090,000?139,160,000?7,324,2116Aston Villa?281,740,000?144,325,000?137,415,000?7,232,3687Sunderland?199,465,000?107,530,000?91,935,000?4,838,6848Newcastle?321,945,000?235,725,000?86,220,000?4,537,8959Fulham?133,281,000?52,895,000?80,386,000?4,230,84210Birmingham City?135,545,000?58,575,000?76,970,000?4,051,05311Everton?218,245,500?165,270,000?52,975,500?2,788,18412Wolves?85,419,000?39,045,000?46,374,000?2,440,73713West Bromwich Albion?93,880,000?52,367,501?41,512,499?2,184,86814Stoke City?61,615,000?24,030,000?37,585,000?1,978,15815Arsenal?273,440,000?237,574,000?35,866,000?1,887,68416Bolton?91,970,000?65,270,000?26,700,000?1,405,26317Blackburn Rovers?189,162,000?176,185,000?12,977,000?683,00018Wigan?82,965,000?77,742,500?5,222,500?274,86819West Ham?189,082,000?184,782,000?4,300,000?226,31620Blackpool?7,002,500?4,785,000?2,217,500?116,711Middlesbrough?193,985,000?120,670,000?73,315,000?3,858,684Hull ?25,470,000?11,980,000?13,490,000?710,000Burnley?22,900,000?18,170,000?4,730,000?248,947Leeds United?145,780,000?141,945,000?3,835,000?201,842Portsmouth?115,100,000?136,645,000-?21,545,000-?1,133,947

[boomer39]

bloody well knew i should have been an accountant...ffs...

[janobi]

I posted where I got the info from, its the transfer league table. And clearly it contradicts what your saying. If you take out the Ronaldo transfer, then your spreadsheet dont look so rosy.

Transfer League Table 1992 to 2011 | League Tables

Thats what every team has spent and sold since 92. You will notice that your team are 5th, with a net spend of over 7m. Whilst that is small I agree, minus out the ronaldo transfer, and your figures would be much much higher.


# Net Spend 92 - 2010 Purchased Gross Sold Nett Per Season

1 Chelsea ?661,640,000 ?203,875,000 ?457,765,000 ?24,092,895
2 Manchester City ?573,180,000 ?138,303,000 ?434,877,000 ?22,888,263
3 Tottenham ?399,050,000 ?201,717,500 ?197,332,500 ?10,385,921
4 Liverpool ?495,805,000 ?304,920,000 ?190,885,000 ?10,046,579
5 Manchester United ?430,250,000 ?291,090,000 ?139,160,000 ?7,324,211
6 Aston Villa ?281,740,000 ?144,325,000 ?137,415,000 ?7,232,368
7 Sunderland ?199,465,000 ?107,530,000 ?91,935,000 ?4,838,684
8 Newcastle ?321,945,000 ?235,725,000 ?86,220,000 ?4,537,895
9 Fulham ?133,281,000 ?52,895,000 ?80,386,000 ?4,230,842
10 Birmingham City ?135,545,000 ?58,575,000 ?76,970,000 ?4,051,053
11 Everton ?218,245,500 ?165,270,000 ?52,975,500 ?2,788,184
12 Wolves ?85,419,000 ?39,045,000 ?46,374,000 ?2,440,737
13 West Bromwich Albion ?93,880,000 ?52,367,501 ?41,512,499 ?2,184,868
14 Stoke City ?61,615,000 ?24,030,000 ?37,585,000 ?1,978,158
15 Arsenal ?273,440,000 ?237,574,000 ?35,866,000 ?1,887,684
16 Bolton ?91,970,000 ?65,270,000 ?26,700,000 ?1,405,263
17 Blackburn Rovers ?189,162,000 ?176,185,000 ?12,977,000 ?683,000
18 Wigan ?82,965,000 ?77,742,500 ?5,222,500 ?274,868
19 West Ham ?189,082,000 ?184,782,000 ?4,300,000 ?226,316
20 Blackpool ?7,002,500 ?4,785,000 ?2,217,500 ?116,711

Middlesbrough ?193,985,000 ?120,670,000 ?73,315,000 ?3,858,684
Hull ?25,470,000 ?11,980,000 ?13,490,000 ?710,000
Burnley ?22,900,000 ?18,170,000 ?4,730,000 ?248,947
Leeds United ?145,780,000 ?141,945,000 ?3,835,000 ?201,842
Portsmouth ?115,100,000 ?136,645,000 -?21,545,000 -?1,133,947

[yasminandrio]

I posted where I got the info from, its the transfer league table. And clearly it contradicts what your saying. If you take out the Ronaldo transfer, then your spreadsheet dont look so rosy.

Transfer League Table 1992 to 2011 | League Tables

Thats what every team has spent and sold since 92. You will notice that your team are 5th, with a net spend of over 7m. Whilst that is small I agree, minus out the ronaldo transfer, and your figures would be much much higher.


# Net Spend 92 - 2010 Purchased Gross Sold Nett Per Season

1 Chelsea ?661,640,000 ?203,875,000 ?457,765,000 ?24,092,895
2 Manchester City ?573,180,000 ?138,303,000 ?434,877,000 ?22,888,263
3 Tottenham ?399,050,000 ?201,717,500 ?197,332,500 ?10,385,921
4 Liverpool ?495,805,000 ?304,920,000 ?190,885,000 ?10,046,579
5 Manchester United ?430,250,000 ?291,090,000 ?139,160,000 ?7,324,211
6 Aston Villa ?281,740,000 ?144,325,000 ?137,415,000 ?7,232,368
7 Sunderland ?199,465,000 ?107,530,000 ?91,935,000 ?4,838,684
8 Newcastle ?321,945,000 ?235,725,000 ?86,220,000 ?4,537,895
9 Fulham ?133,281,000 ?52,895,000 ?80,386,000 ?4,230,842
10 Birmingham City ?135,545,000 ?58,575,000 ?76,970,000 ?4,051,053
11 Everton ?218,245,500 ?165,270,000 ?52,975,500 ?2,788,184
12 Wolves ?85,419,000 ?39,045,000 ?46,374,000 ?2,440,737
13 West Bromwich Albion ?93,880,000 ?52,367,501 ?41,512,499 ?2,184,868
14 Stoke City ?61,615,000 ?24,030,000 ?37,585,000 ?1,978,158
15 Arsenal ?273,440,000 ?237,574,000 ?35,866,000 ?1,887,684
16 Bolton ?91,970,000 ?65,270,000 ?26,700,000 ?1,405,263
17 Blackburn Rovers ?189,162,000 ?176,185,000 ?12,977,000 ?683,000
18 Wigan ?82,965,000 ?77,742,500 ?5,222,500 ?274,868
19 West Ham ?189,082,000 ?184,782,000 ?4,300,000 ?226,316
20 Blackpool ?7,002,500 ?4,785,000 ?2,217,500 ?116,711

Middlesbrough ?193,985,000 ?120,670,000 ?73,315,000 ?3,858,684
Hull ?25,470,000 ?11,980,000 ?13,490,000 ?710,000
Burnley ?22,900,000 ?18,170,000 ?4,730,000 ?248,947
Leeds United ?145,780,000 ?141,945,000 ?3,835,000 ?201,842
Portsmouth ?115,100,000 ?136,645,000 -?21,545,000 -?1,133,947

Not really i posted the same table in the second post and united paid about 12.24m for ronaldo and sold him for about 80m i would call that good business not man utd buying the league, I for one would say united have never bought the league Just bought players to improve the squad!! It hasn't always worked like that but we've never bought the league

[janobi]

Not really i posted the same table in the second post and united paid about 12.24m for ronaldo and sold him for about 80m i would call that good business not man utd buying the league, I for one would say united have never bought the league Just bought players to improve the squad!! It hasn't always worked like that but we've never bought the league

Im not saying it wasnt great business, as clearly it was. However, with the removal of that transfer alone, its a completely different story.

How can you say that Man Utd haven't bought the league, when clearly that table tells a different story? The only team that have even come close without spending has been Everton, who finished 4th with little or no money spent.

[yasminandrio]

Im not saying it wasnt great business, as clearly it was. However, with the removal of that transfer alone, its a completely different story.

How can you say that Man Utd haven't bought the league, when clearly that table tells a different story? The only team that have even come close without spending has been Everton, who finished 4th with little or no money spent.

Because i beleave they haven't they have won 12 EPL titles and your saying they bought the league i would say they did it through keeping the same manager which brings in stablity, and then stablity brings in a togetherness with in the team and thats what brings in the constant waves of trophies?? what do you think to that?? also you said Arsenal also bought the league!! don't think so

[boomer39]

i thought the thread was about "can money make you a big club"?? the answer is no.......
ask blackburn... ask sunderland,who were known for spending in the 1950's..
a big club will always be a big club.... success does not always make you big club... ie ipswich, champs in 1962? i think, so they have won the league since then the same number of times as man city... but who is the bigger club? no contest!!

[andy1967]

i thought the thread was about "can money make you a big club"?? the answer is no.......
ask blackburn... ask sunderland,who were known for spending in the 1950's..
a big club will always be a big club.... success does not always make you big club... ie ipswich, champs in 1962? i think, so they have won the league since then the same number of times as man city... but who is the bigger club? no contest!!

1950! 1960! All very long ago history boomer. Were talking football today, why keep bringing very old history into football off today. It's about now or last few seasons, about teams what are around now and their positions and what they are doing and winning. Its the premiership now and which big clubs have won that Title, not in the 50's 60's its 2011 boomer and the clubs what are big now.
12 times UTD have won the premiership now and are in the UCL next season, LFC have won the premiership how many times? are LFC still a big club where next season they will be playing in the UCL.

[Wolfpack]

Just looking at those figures Just shows why tickets and just about everything associated wjth football cost an arm and a leg. It's a shame since no matter what the person with the most money wins the most. All professional sports need a salary cap. When will a team like Fullam win the title? surely never since they don't generate enough money and if a team like them develop a top footballer they usually sell them. Money always brings success just look a Chelsea. They weren't a team scaring anyone in the prem til the Russian bought them and threw money at them. The teams with the money are always against a cap but it is needed.

[Snowy79]

I'm sure the top foreign players don't join British Clubs for the weather. If you took away or limited the amount of money they are paid we'd only be left with home grown talent and almost every team in the Premier Division would lose a lot of their plastic fans as the standards would seriously drop. British teams would struggle to get into Europe and lose even more sponsor money, then the Business men that are snapping up the top clubs would find a better investment for their money and football would get back to where it should be. Who knows 10 years down the line a British team may be good enough to get somewhere in the World Cup.

[boomer39]

1950! 1960! All very long ago history boomer. Were talking football today, why keep bringing very old history into football off today. It's about now or last few seasons, about teams what are around now and their positions and what they are doing and winning. Its the premiership now and which big clubs have won that Title, not in the 50's 60's its 2011 boomer and the clubs what are big now.
12 times UTD have won the premiership now and are in the UCL next season, LFC have won the premiership how many times? are LFC still a big club where next season they will be playing in the UCL.

whendid you first win the league??? without the 1st there would be no 19!!!!! history!!!!