Bedroom tax, new thread !

[flyingpig]

He intends to exploit a loophole in the 1985 Housing Act which means box rooms would be exempt from the tax.

Michael and wife Marie, 59, share a three-bed bungalow in Newcastle but say their third bedroom is a ?box room? covered by the Act passed by Thatcher?s Tories.

Under section 326, floor space between 50 sq ft and 70 sq ft is described as not fit to be occupied by a person.

Michael said: ?Our smallest box room is 48 sq ft so it cannot be classed as a room, so it cannot be taxed.?

I work in social housing and have a legal background and hte following is how it is - There is no regulation in Social Housing that defines a bedroom. There only time it is defined is how the property is classed for tenancy, tax reasons etc - exactly the same as in the private sector and is defined by the owner / landlord

Under Section 326 of the 1985 Social Housing Act the following applies 2 people 110 sq ft, 1.5 persons 90sq ft, 1 person 70sq ft and 0.5 person, 50 sq ft.

Under s326(2)(b) the act states a room is available as sleeping accomodationif it is of a type normally in the locality either as a bedroom or living room.

[flyingpig]

Meant to add that for the purposes of law 0.5 persons is someone under 10 years old. Nowhere does it say, no room is fit to be uncoppied if under 70 sq ft....

Social landlords would be in trouble if that applied!!

[flyingpig]

of course not, if its private then you will get rent benefit up to a maximum of ?xxx.xx then you need to make the rest of the money up yerself, just like if joe blogs wanted the same thing, he would have to come up with the extra rent ontop of what the dhss give ya (if your on benefits or low income working).

Why should the state pay for any RPSH exhorbitantly high rents that are over and above what people reuqire?

Same difference!!?!?!?!?!?

Strange thinking by yourself!

[Snowy79]

Not being a council I tenant can someone tell me if one person is living in a three bedroom house and pays ?89 per week rent. What happens when another two tenants get moved into the property. How much do the other two tenants contribute?

I may be wrong but logic tells me if the three contribute to pay the set rate of ?89, as opposed to the tax payer paying each of them ?70 accomodation subsidies the tax payer will just have to pay ?89. Saving ?121 per week.

[tshirtman]

Re: Bedroom tax, new thread !

Not being a council I tenant can someone tell me if one person is living in a three bedroom house and pays ?89 per week rent. What happens when another two tenants get moved into the property. How much do the other two tenants contribute?

I may be wrong but logic tells me if the three contribute to pay the set rate of ?89, as opposed to the tax payer paying each of them ?70 accomodation subsidies the tax payer will just have to pay ?89. Saving ?121 per week.

I'm sure thered will be along soon to tell you, he seems to know everything.

how do you know council rent is ?89 if you're not a council tenants.

[Snowy79]

The ?89 rent was mentioned in a previous post when talking about a three bedroom flat by someone who had cut and pasted it no doubt from a left wing newspaper.

I'm sure thered will be along soon to tell you, he seems to know everything.

how do you know council rent is ?89 if you're not a council tenants.

[Bulld0g]

So if those affected are the ones claiming benefits, then how can they take a lodger in and charge rent if it's not their property? or have i missed something.

I'm not 100% sure how this will affect people but affect them it will. Is this the scenarios we are facing?

Ok so I've brought my family up in this house for 30 years and they have moved on and someone else now needs these extra bedrooms, so now it's time for me to move out and stop sponging so some new people with bigger families on benefits can move in and sponge?

My family are now grown up and this is the only place i have ever known, i've lived here most of my life, i feel safe and secure here but now i have to move into a 1 bed roomed flat in a shit hole of an area where drug dealing is rife and gangs of youths hang around outside my new flat smoking dope shouting and screaming and boozing every night?

My son/Daughter/Husband or wife is disabled and my house has been adapted to suit their needs but i don't qualify for exemption.

My son/Daughter/Husband or wife is away on tour of duty with the forces so i don't qualify for exemption.

My My son/Daughter/Husband or wife is in prison but it's ok, i'm exempt and will qualify for benefits.

I have a spare room which i keep for when my children visit me, but i will have to pay the bedroom tax because i don't qualify.

There are going to be more people suffering than benefiting from this fiasco. This is just another Tory cockup brought in by a government who don't give a shit about the working class or unemployed.

If it was thought out and balanced then it might be a good thing, but it isn't so it's not.

[flyingpig]

social rents vary within which area you live. I tenant who claims benefits can take in a lodger, but would have to decalre any income to the relevant agency.

We are working on this with the BA to help provide supports to tenants. The scenarios Bulldog mentions are right, however, more people will benefit. In fact everyone will benefit because it i aimed to change the welfare state for the better. Something needs to change. There are not enough larger houses, we aer facing a housing crisis, people who are on benefits shouldnt really have a choice.

[Bulld0g]

I take it your from the "Tory" part of Liverpool with an outlook that supports this absurdity m8.

[thered]

I'm sure thered will be along soon to tell you, he seems to know everything.

how do you know council rent is ?89 if you're not a council tenants.

yes i am here do not fear

rent is different to area

even where i live a few streets can up council rent by about ?40

I live in ex council house but i have experience of the sytem through my own finds and throught getting the daughter a flat and very recently a house, it still works on importance criteria but

Its changed now to bidding system, they come out on Thursday, i went on web at midnight wednesday

and bidded on houses you could bid on 3

Most of them i was number 1 and first on the list but you find as week goes on you drop

This is because of other people on housing list may be more important (homeless or been on list longer) even though she was in top band people came first

Initial weeks i was dropping to 30+ this came down every week to the point where she was in the top 5

After that it didnt take very long and she was offered a house

Rent for a 3 bedder in slightly better area was around ?135

Where we live they are about ?115

Her rent is for a 2 bedder is about ?94 wheras the other area is about ?114

We have better areas a little further out the way but i did not look but i assume they are more expensive still and tbh rarely come up for rent as they are mainly bought

Private Rentals in the area are little different in rental to coucil rates tbh as DSS will only pay more or less what they pay council house next door, any extra paid for by private tennant


I am not sure about other areas but it seems like there are places available, although people seem not to see them. I assume places like London area the council rents will be much higher but i suppose its relevant to price

My sister lives in greater London and 3 years ago paid nearly ?300000 for a house, she could have same one near me for around ?140,000 so i suppose its all relevant to where you live

Maybe the housing crisis wont be around much longer anyway, seems like everyone will be slashing up

Instead of going to off license, and weekly meets with care workers

[thered]

So if those affected are the ones claiming benefits, then how can they take a lodger in and charge rent if it's not their property? or have i missed something.

I'm not 100% sure how this will affect people but affect them it will. Is this the scenarios we are facing?

Ok so I've brought my family up in this house for 30 years and they have moved on and someone else now needs these extra bedrooms, so now it's time for me to move out and stop sponging so some new people with bigger families on benefits can move in and sponge?

My family are now grown up and this is the only place i have ever known, i've lived here most of my life, i feel safe and secure here but now i have to move into a 1 bed roomed flat in a shit hole of an area where drug dealing is rife and gangs of youths hang around outside my new flat smoking dope shouting and screaming and boozing every night?

My son/Daughter/Husband or wife is disabled and my house has been adapted to suit their needs but i don't qualify for exemption.

My son/Daughter/Husband or wife is away on tour of duty with the forces so i don't qualify for exemption.

My My son/Daughter/Husband or wife is in prison but it's ok, i'm exempt and will qualify for benefits.

I have a spare room which i keep for when my children visit me, but i will have to pay the bedroom tax because i don't qualify.

There are going to be more people suffering than benefiting from this fiasco. This is just another Tory cockup brought in by a government who don't give a shit about the working class or unemployed.

If it was thought out and balanced then it might be a good thing, but it isn't so it's not.

I take all these points on board

and whilst i initially agreed on a couple im not sure anymore

I do think there should be safegurads

eg man lives on own loses job has kids stay i think he should be given 6-12 months leeway to find a job if no job found after the period then he pays it or goes

Prisoners should pay no question

Disability i think they should stump up tbh, they get enough money to pay it, might sound harsh but some of the disabled dont even get the money a bit like teenage mums spending milk tokens and baby money on scratchcard booze and fags. A lot of disabled a mere cash cows

Army i initially agreed especially as it was near the prisoner part and it is wrong that prisoners dont have any extra to pay but army does

Already mentioned about prisoners but has been mentioned on here if they want room they send home lodge

if they had a mortgage they would still have to pay so why not pay rent for their room

[Bulld0g]

Just to add to what's been posted on this thread, a lot of people on here know where i live and i would like to mention my local housing trust who are 100% opposed to the bedroom tax and they are doing their best to challenge it.

[thered]

Just to add to what's been posted on this thread, a lot of people on here know where i live and i would like to mention my local housing trust who are 100% opposed to the bedroom tax and they are doing their best to challenge it.

Most people probably are tbh i would argue a housing trust wants the most rent it can get and more houses building they can rent out

rather than people being housed in this way

I do realise that there needs to be more housing made but if this route saves 1/2 to 1 million of the apparantly 1.5M shortfall it will serve its purpose

Borrowing more money to build houses has no long term gain, as i have stated many times

The only time this will work is if more people who live in them work than claim HB

or they plan on selling them for profit

If even half are housing benefit they will never break even, by the time repairs kick in and yearly boiler/heating maintenace comes around the houses will always make nothing

The money invested buying land and building will never be recouped, the short term lift in economy will be only pay in part what it cost. and that includes dole money saved and extra revenue from jobs

All paid for by borrowed cash, never to be gotten back in full.

[flyingpig]

I take it your from the "Tory" part of Liverpool with an outlook that supports this absurdity m8.

Definately not, I am a socialist and not a tory....

Why should someone who is single get to live in a four bed house and the state pay the increase in housing benefit, when they dont work, cant work, wont work?

The ethos behind it is right. Should we (the state) go on forever paying housing benefits for things people dont need which causes a shortage for others that do need?

Can you tell me why you are against it?

[Saltire]

And this is exactly what is happening to the people in social housing.
The private sector has had to deal with this so called 'bedroom tax' for about 10 years.

Why should people in social housing have bigger houses paid for, when people in private rented properties have had their housing benefit cut and have to make up the difference themselves?

happening to people with a 1 spare room no bigger than a box too, so dont even try and go down this road "again" about "bigger" houses as its getting boring now mate, sorry, but it is, heard it all before if you read back.