Bedroom tax, new thread !

[GastonJ]

Sorry Cunny. It was a reply to a message from GastonJ - whose posts I usually find very good, however, the post was a generalistic which was unfounded and way off!

My general post was to another general post to point out that you can't make general comments as was made. Mental illness is real, it exists, it can't be seen like physical illness and affects people in different ways and has many causes.

Again it was made against a post that generalised that people who had mental illnesses could work when it's not always the case. So yes I gave an extreme example. I'm sure wherever that woman was employed she would have been a danger to anyone. So no, mental illness shouldn't be trivialised as an excuse to say such people should work just because their illness can't be seen.

I won't be posting again.

[Saltire]

Mods/admin, can you please tidy up this thread and take out any posts that have nothing at all to do with BEDROOM TAX, these people have hyjacked my thread, I come back and then I see all this rubbish.

Thank you please

p.s
the posts that have got nothing to do with anyone elses buisness too please.
Mannnn, first post in about a year, has over 3000 views, over 300 posts and then they start all this nonsense.

I trust you will get the posts sorted. cheers

[Snowy79]

The fact that some posters are highlighting problems that some people are suffering from in society highlights why the Government needs to save money. We're running out of money to pay for other services so lets get back to the original topic.

In my opinion the Government are not taking money from people directly or stopping them from being able to pay their rent. They are still getting their legal entitlement as per the rules. The thing thats making it harder for individuals to pay the rent who are living in properties larger than they are entitled are themselves. The government is not stopping them moving out and into a smaller property or to another property and sharing If there are no smaller properties available.

You can bet that even if there were enough properties available we would still find thousands arguing that they are not in the correct area etc. I'm sorry but beggars can't be choosers. If you have a roof over your head and not paying for it think yourself lucky. There's loads of countries out there that don't provide accomodation

[jordigirl]

i agree we need to save money and agree with this tax in principle, but if people agree to move to a smaller property, should they have to pay it? if there is no properties available?
who will actually benefit from the bigger houses? the british people or people coming in from other countries?

what happens when the gates are open fully to romania and bulgaria on jan 1st 2014? we can afford to keep our own lot let alone everyone elses??

[cgscott]

My general post was to another general post to point out that you can't make general comments as was made. Mental illness is real, it exists, it can't be seen like physical illness and affects people in different ways and has many causes.

Again it was made against a post that generalised that people who had mental illnesses could work when it's not always the case. So yes I gave an extreme example. I'm sure wherever that woman was employed she would have been a danger to anyone. So no, mental illness shouldn't be trivialised as an excuse to say such people should work just because their illness can't be seen.

I won't be posting again.

Youd be mental if you did post again

[thered]

Maybe it is real, i have yet too see it


There are many professionals who end up killing partners you dont need a book or assesment to say your deranged it can just happen, it only takes a moment

What i know is fact based on work and trips to the gym.

It is amazing how many people you see waiting outside Weatherspoons for opening time and truly amazing how many sick people go to the gym.

If somebody really is mentally ill seclusion is the last thing you want, there are now hundreds of thousands of mental care workers who think the conditions are real, i know from my own experience these are not. Mental illness is a fashion accessory atm it cannot be seen or proven it basically relies on ticking boxes and diagnosis from story given. I would say is as high as 80-90% pure BS. There are workers with same issues


If you are on JSA and live on your own yes you will really feel the pinch it will be really hard. Anyone as a couple or with kids or on disability money will not struggle at all and if they do, it is of their own making. They need to budget better

Yes Atos is a load of crap there sole purpose is to get people off the sick and in work. They rely on medical evidence basically which if lacking you end up on JSA. Its no coincidence over 50% of verdicts are turned over on appeal but many drop out and find work as the appeal process takes so long. Is this the governments aim, yes of course (labour policy btw)

Now dla will be given same mean tested tests and many will lose cars ect unless they win appeal. I would wager around 70% lose benefit as simply there is nothing wrong with the ones i know . The only legitimate people i know who were on it are both dead, they were awarded it upon cancer diagnosis and received until they died.

This scenario and similar and genuinely disabled people are the only people i think should get believe should get disability.

The rest with mental health issues should be just given councilling IMO, as anybody at anytime can take a life or their own whether you see care workers or not it happens and there will never be a thing anyone can do to change it

"Bedroom tax" is a fair way to get people in the correct homes, there maybe needs to be a few concessions but the basic meaning is correct, you cant please everyone all the time but people do need to take responsibility for themselves

[tshirtman]

Maybe it is real, i have yet too see it

do you really think I went to University for 3 years to study a made up illness.

Do you really think the state will spend ?30 billion + per year on a made up illness,

The mental patient who stabbed me in the leg was real, the patient that broke my collarbone was real.

just because you haven't seen it means it not real, have you ever seen anyone with scurvy, that's real.

stick to commenting about things you know about, mental health has enough stigma as it is.

[Saltire]

ok, so lets say the people, any people, have mental health issues and some physical issues but still cant get DLA for whatever reason, ok ?

they have no kids, no other means of money apart from long term sick money, whats its called, errrm, (cant remember, the one you get if on long term unemployment for years ?)

they have a brand new built house, beautiful, driveway, everything, 2 bedrooms but want a 1 bedroom, they just cant afford that ?50 per month extra they have to find for the BEDROOM TAX from april 1st.

Where do they go, what do they do, who do they turn to ?

Is there a lawyer will take on that type of case, or a law centre, or what ?

I havent made any calls yet to any lawyers or adviced anyone on what to do etc, so as the thread started, this is the kind of advice i am after.

Maybe that will help more and also stop all you squabbling too.

Just trying to get back to the stream on things here man.

cheers.

[Snowy79]

Saltire. I've said in many posts. They take in a tenant. They may not be happy doing it but it's the one easy option open to them. The property ultimately belongs to the Council so if I was the council and had a homeless single person rather than waste the limited money they have putting them up in private accomodation I'd be filling the empty bedrooms first. If they don't like it tough.

[Saltire]

Saltire. I've said in many posts. They take in a tenant. They may not be happy doing it but it's the one easy option open to them. The property ultimately belongs to the Council so if I was the council and had a homeless single person rather than waste the limited money they have putting them up in private accomodation I'd be filling the empty bedrooms first. If they don't like it tough.

cr*p, forgot to add the part about not wanting a tenant/lodger as it was maybe a single woman on her own which meant bedroom doors litrally touching each other and just the one toilet outside those bedroom doors, the woman has friends round every day but the lodger is a guy and needs a sleep so he cant get a sleep and vice versa, i should have added that in.

Thats never going to work, plus there is no 1 bedroom houses to move to, council ones I mean, private yes in decent area, costs a fortune, double the rent of a 1 bedroom council house.

[thered]

do you really think I went to University for 3 years to study a made up illness.

Do you really think the state will spend ?30 billion + per year on a made up illness,

The mental patient who stabbed me in the leg was real, the patient that broke my collarbone was real.

just because you haven't seen it means it not real, have you ever seen anyone with scurvy, that's real.

stick to commenting about things you know about, mental health has enough stigma as it is.

Does that not happen in street to people? rarely a day goes by without someone in the news

does it not happen to guards in prison?


do you have to be mental ?? no way at all


I have life skills, I know whats real and to be brutally honest you can go to uni for 30 years, the people i know will still run rings round the likes of yourself. They come away and laugh about the person they just spoke too

Wont change the fact that majority of people pull the wool over your eyes, you are taught to believe the patient, You are spoonfed by what they say and their actions. Even if you dont believe you are forced too just in case. If they think they are losing or in a situation where drastic action is needed they will take it. They are far from stupid, you watch saint and scroungers people you wouldnt expect fraud the sytem

Papers nearly everyday done for benefit fraud

Why?

Cos they cant keep mouth shut

The majority of people will never be close to getting caught, there is simply not enough resources.


Mental illness has stigma because the vast majority, if not all use it for their own purpose.

Ask anyone on dole, they say cant work i have bipolar, i have depression

People at work get depressed and have bipolar how is that possible ??


We will never agree on it so thats last post on subject from me.

[Snowy79]

You're describing the type of person that needs a wake up call. It shouldn't be about what the individual wants but what is best for society. If I was in charge of housing and someone came up with that shi@ I'd make her the tenant and move her into another property. I'm not paying my taxes so some spoilt brat can sit at home all day chatting to her mates.

I'm sure there are plenty of females out there looking for accomodation and maybe if she went out looking for work she wouldn't be around the house bothering her tenant. As for giving a single person a brand new property with a drive those type of properties should be going to someone who is trying to help society. You know the type. They have enough pride to accept low paid work but still deserve to get their accomodation subsidised because they are at least trying to help themselves and maybe need somewhere to park their car. A single person that sits on their arse all day chatting to their mates would be the last person that should get one.

As I've said there's always scum out there that even if you gave them everything they'd still complain it's not enough.

cr*p, forgot to add the part about not wanting a tenant/lodger as it was maybe a single woman on her own which meant bedroom doors litrally touching each other and just the one toilet outside those bedroom doors, the woman has friends round every day but the lodger is a guy and needs a sleep so he cant get a sleep and vice versa, i should have added that in.

Thats never going to work, plus there is no 1 bedroom houses to move to, council ones I mean, private yes in decent area, costs a fortune, double the rent of a 1 bedroom council house.

[harpic]

just something i found

The bedroom tax

If you are a single person living a 2 bed council house you will see a reduction in your Housing Benefit of 14% because you have 1 more bedroom than you need. If it?s a 3 bed council or housing association house you will lose 25% of your Housing Benefit because you have 2 bedrooms too many. But what is a bedroom?

The bedroom tax as we see above is based on bedrooms yet there is no definition of what is a bedroom and the coalition are leaving that to social landlords to define and DWP will not define what constitutes a bedroom. That is unacceptable and wrong. You cannot have a benefit decided on the subjective opinion of varying landlords it just doesn?t make any sense.

Houses in Multiple Occupation (HMOs) do have a size definition of what constitutes a bedroom. That size is 6.5 square metres or 70.1 square feet . Anything under 10? x 7? is less than 70 square feet (and 6.5sq/m) and so if not a bedroom under HMO regulations. Yet many ?bedrooms? can be less than this size of area and shouldn?t be classed as a bedroom for HB purposes; and further I would argue and indeed advocate that tenants who have such small rooms to appeal and challenge any deduction of HB on that basis.

[flyingpig]

Info on legal challenge

Bedroom tax to be introduced before legal challenge | News | Inside Housing

[Saltire]

Info on legal challenge

Bedroom tax to be introduced before legal challenge | News | Inside Housing

the protests and marches will go ahead though, tories are already thinking of a uturn on it because of the pressure of that and the other parties including the lib dems being against it.

The engluerlush government are idiots, they think they can easily get away with this, think again, I'm already one of the helper/organisers of the march and protest in Glasgow, I think every major city will have one, and you know what happens when they dont go according to what people know they are being ripped off for, lets just say it probably wont be nice days to come until these rejects of a joke english government get a grip and lets face it, it was the whole of england that voted them in, not scotland !

(or better still, the british people force a new election now, why not, its possible). PEOPLE POWER !